From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp2 ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id UOrkDXWoE2GhFQEAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 12:37:41 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp2 with LMTPS id OAdnCXWoE2HIQwAAB5/wlQ (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 10:37:41 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DE8F02CF6F for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 12:37:40 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:49182 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mDlcB-0006eX-VD for larch@yhetil.org; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 06:37:39 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:34032) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mDlc3-0006eP-Az for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 06:37:31 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:54658) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mDlc1-0005Xt-Ov; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 06:37:29 -0400 Received: from [2a01:e0a:1d:7270:af76:b9b:ca24:c465] (port=48750 helo=ribbon) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mDlc1-0004lj-Fa; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 06:37:29 -0400 From: =?utf-8?Q?Ludovic_Court=C3=A8s?= To: Christopher Baines Subject: Re: Project direction with testing changes (branches and patches) References: <87bl6hbd05.fsf@cbaines.net> <87a6lwoqrs.fsf@gnu.org> <87r1f2i82z.fsf@cbaines.net> <87im0d96ot.fsf@gnu.org> <87czqlhzia.fsf@cbaines.net> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: 24 Thermidor an 229 de la =?utf-8?Q?R=C3=A9volution?= X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x090B11993D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-pc-linux-gnu Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2021 12:37:27 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87czqlhzia.fsf@cbaines.net> (Christopher Baines's message of "Tue, 10 Aug 2021 20:26:53 +0100") Message-ID: <87im0cnu6w.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org, Mathieu Othacehe , guix-maintainers@gnu.org Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1628678260; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=+yCvsCMbYIigblV8tAOMpO6cc1LHOSFTjJJ0CmPmXV0=; b=J2ds8UnkqA4DfzUAlQNXm3mT7Rig2vBplFsAVAOXCih1jNcOKov5kx7SKsMKPFjdBzrA5v GCohSeBsWjaK8bj8rYa7Qiaw6CJJua35+vhY+4nXcThH6ROZEg90MfWTydCr4s6sW44nGA +C6aIAcMgaNd2r12mFZaCZh9dnD5/GClg2NRLaCHd3tUMQaqEpnwirWxoSSTd7G7dgwalr HSdVGjyz5FsK5Dlckb3U2gTHcypZNshGRwfKyeYvn4+kH/3BX9kj2g+Yp5ZeimwpgHo9NL lFOzpR1XiiG+yzaSc6RS95Ph5AtQZvVqSdiCTCtGQ5J3JjZNWRAcsb0oIEkEyA== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1628678261; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=TZjMvnkXDI2h4upgkp035mQN2vIcM2IgXCoztE/Pqe6SNri0xZl3HBX31MLWNyV48rYX9J dauhCkcQ22tk0MUaCz4SuixbFRKWEQcMcEEj8HEI7xdI2hMRpwLEB599r2IbFOy+8zE9rQ v+nCci7lA9XwDVG2930AmyO5y9pBVMuWydtWczklnLXCC1thf+shi7xkfDEtPdgnURMruX p211ysCU/kdtt/LaNNuLk1ks0nSHeBA1dYWGGB9je+hG2/P5MZjdOupxQnrFthF9qVsgKq 0KLR03PO9XGkvKqrdBmL4cPRypo5OKMl1YygiXpdSn/tvVmZKAnAuyRIUZrRBA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.91 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: DE8F02CF6F X-Spam-Score: -2.91 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: Lb7FsScBZDoA Hi Chris, Christopher Baines skribis: > I was thinking of using Cuirass for building derivations when testing > patches, but I gave up on that approach back in 2019 after trying to use > it (I discussed trying to use it here [1]). > > 1: https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guix-devel/2019-03/msg00010.html > > I was specifically thinking about testing patches when I initially > designed both the Guix Data Service and Guix Build Coordinator. For me > at least, the focus has been on this direction for the last ~3 years. > > I realise that Cuirass now has some of the functionality that the Guix > Data Service was written to provide, like tracking all > packages/derivations in each revision. But from my perspective, Cuirass > still lacks key things like being able to compare two revisions and > tracking lint warnings. Cuirass has always had to track packages/derivations in each revision; it=E2=80=99s been this way from day 1 when it started more or less as a revisited Hydra, which did exactly this. The Guix Data Service provides info not available elsewhere though, and that=E2=80=99s why we need to take advantage of it. > There's also things like testing derivations on different hardware, > regularly testing fixed output derivations and automatically retrying > failed builds that I think the Guix Build Coordinator is better setup to > do compared to Cuirass. > > But this feedback is why I started this thread. I don't see the same > option as was found for improving substitutes by setting up a new > substitute server using the Guix Data Service and the Guix Build > Coordinator. There's a much stronger need to have one approach as a > project for testing changes, and if using the Guix Data Service and Guix > Build Coordinator isn't looking like a convincing option at this point, > that's better to know now, compared to later when more time and effort > has been put in. I can sympathize with the bitter feeling. I do think though that we must work collectively; to me it=E2=80=99d be a problem if misplaced compet= ition were to prevent us from moving forward. Several concrete incremental steps were proposed in this thread and earlier. Instead of trying to provide a definite answer as to whether the grand plan you propose is a convincing option at this point, I=E2=80=99d like us to collect the low-hanging fruits, in an opportunistic way. :-) Several easy hacks have been proposed in this thread and before: custom web/CLI views for the Data Service, Cuirass APIs to spin up specs on the fly, Data Service integration in Mumi/Gitile, Cuirass notifications sent to the Data Service, etc. None of these is impressive in itself, but each of these can be a step making our hacker lives better, IMO. WDYT? Thanks, Ludo=E2=80=99.