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Subject: Re: How can we decrease the cognitive overhead for contributors? In-Reply-To: <867cozr0gd.fsf@gmail.com> Organization: Xelera.eu References: <20230827135726.y33t55w4cvq6zsvb@X-kone> <874jkift8v.fsf@gmail.com> <867cp4sj7k.fsf@gmail.com> <38242808-2f06-4674-3842-aea1a5378d05@gmail.com> <86v8cop6sy.fsf@gmail.com> <8634zrpt40.fsf@gmail.com> <37edb289-d49e-0d74-05f2-4cc93c6129aa@gmail.com> <867cozr0gd.fsf@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2023 14:19:47 +0200 Message-ID: <87h6o0dhr0.fsf@xelera.eu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Received-SPF: pass client-ip=46.4.214.66; envelope-from=g@xelera.eu; helo=ns13.heimat.it X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Queue-Id: A761D6681E X-Migadu-Scanner: mx1.migadu.com X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.82 X-Spam-Score: -2.82 X-TUID: /msoit466p2T --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello, (I find it difficult to efficiently follow this thread and to keep up to date with reading it, so please forgive me if someone else already addressed my considerations) Simon Tournier writes: [...] > =C2=AB For which contributors do we want to/can we decrease the cognitive > overhead? =C2=BB, so I read it as: do we discuss about someone who is alr= eady > playing guitar or someone who is knowing nothing about music. > > We already have the answer: we are speaking about someone who already > plays guitar (a skilled programmer). There are many ways to contribute to Guix: =2D-8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8--- =2D Project Management =2D Art =2D Documentation =2D Packages =2D Programming =2D System Administration =2D Test and Bug Reports =2D Translation =2D-8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8--- (https://guix.gnu.org/en/contribute/) and just a few of them requires to be a skilled programmer :-) But you are absolutely right, we are talking about someone who already have: =2D-8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8--- (skill (or project-management user-interface-design graphical-design multimedia-design technical-documentation-writing guix-programming guile-programming program-debugging system-administration translation-of-tachnical-documents)) =20=20=20=20=20 =2D-8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8--- I'd also say that other "low level" skills are dependencies for some or all of the above mentioned skills, like: git-dvcs-usage, text-mua-usage As already mentioned, a conditio sine qua non (hard dependency) to contribute to Guix (as to as many many other international distributed projects) is to have "high level" skill named manage-communications-in-EN. Last but not least, a "meta skill" is that you accept to do all of this as a volunteer in a large group of volunteers, with very few /direct/ rewards - the most important one being to improve the best ever free software distro [1] - and many many issues to address... Quite a lot of skills to be able to contribute, I'd say. Furthermore, not a skill but another requirement not to be underestimated is you need a certain amount of time and unfortunately many people can only subtract that from their (often already scarce) free time. Probably we should find a way to /introduce/ old and new contributors to this concepts since I feel someway sometimes they are forgotten or underestimated. [...] > Somehow, now we have to discuss about specific task, task by task, and > propose how to improve. Survey is one next action for collecting > data. My 2 cents: surveys should be _carefully_ designed or the resulting data would be useless at best, misleading at worst [...] > The improvement had been the removal of the friction by switching to > some web interface. Now, the process is probably not easy for people > like me that are not used to web interface, although interacting with > web interface is a simpler task than configuring some tools for > editing translation files. There is a weblate CLI we should probably package in Guix: https://docs.weblate.org/en/latest/wlc.html I just hope that changing from a git-commit-based approach to a weblate-tool approach have helped find many more active translators: https://translate.fedoraproject.org/projects/guix/#information > we are far from the initial discussion. ;-) Sorry: OT... OT?!? :-O > I do not see =E2=80=9Cthe practice of controlling access to information, > advanced levels of study, elite sections of society, etc=E2=80=9C. Well,= are > you French? ;-) Because I feel we are discussing unrelated points > emerging although we are agree on the core and we just detail tiny > variations of the same thing. :-) If you want I can add a little bit of Italian attitide at discussing in detail tiny variations of the same thing :-O... just joking, eh! ;-) [...] Ciao! Gio' [1] well, I'm biased :-D =2D-=20 Giovanni Biscuolo Xelera IT Infrastructures --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQJABAEBCgAqFiEERcxjuFJYydVfNLI5030Op87MORIFAmT/BeMMHGdAeGVsZXJh LmV1AAoJENN9DqfOzDkSwrIP/1VZZr1wB/mAQMvURxm3AfqCjFfODkJ8u5snLM9w wLgyHV+C27erjNbJ80K+UIet9ZLzI0rWesY5ZT6lYNSHN5VW2mPfe9XoOGZgQ5R3 Vn+stXjjxfCBA6DrauKwRW7tX4Pg1/QUgpJoyRotJM8MfDBV3Oa4WapVAc7+YkOT 2F7FNmcV8CMEjve+CVxKKyuP0bwjiQSrlS6qYF/UJa4hCZQokpyF6bd87UGMLG9W 1ne0Pvj3lJzkZ0GI6oyOonaITVQW1VoGPNVh/FSFMM8HMzuYpBMWG1UEZyfqcNhK eXW9F4u2K2BTRkWzdSKZEJvmqfoqifGmHZLfX7G8ce29rfYE/Q6Lxi3v3mR8Kd+g InKLhrYpU0+BAoMo5Oo/kVPUf6M6b7wQI9h3wO0qAvBjN5IMhEWz6n7de9B9Cjy1 OtqsNI0VMY0+4j7GGiu7NxBbPjZevcmNIzGAVBImXZaVxD8LCq1rtAtrkvTPozvO fiwNoyUoYnqf9DaKSK0y2wmHWtJ74scgR+tLA9L2jFvgFnY+xG1Dz/AVXO3HlOcl GCYzk8/Vp0ihO4dWrfnDzWcE+U6g/+9oOPhz861mWQ3l9kxFROjsnM6/ETfNKhWT IcFAsDH5Q+7G50k0AaAxGbhJEAtkjAh8XxAUApHaZU8j/db3f7Rou2YU7Ensa4gR Q63a =L3KJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=--