guix environment --load vs. --file inconsistency

guix environment --load vs. --file inconsistency

[Attila Lendvai]

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dear all,

i was writing the documentation of a guix.scm file, and i realized that there's an inconsistency among the three most used commands in this context:

so, there's:
- guix build --file
- guix package --file

and then there's:
- guix environment --load
- guix pack # has neither

i'd propose to change guix environment to also use --file, but maybe i'm overlooking something, so, please speak up if you think it's a bad idea!

i never used guix pack, but maybe that also deserves a --file argument?

- attila
PGP: 5D5F 45C7 DFCD 0A39

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Re: guix environment --load vs. --file inconsistency

[Ludovic Courtès]

Hi Attila,

Attila Lendvai <attila@lendvai.name> skribis:

> i was writing the documentation of a guix.scm file, and i realized that there's an inconsistency among the three most used commands in this context:
>
> so, there's:
> - guix build --file
> - guix package --file
>
> and then there's:
> - guix environment --load
> - guix pack # has neither
>
> i'd propose to change guix environment to also use --file, but maybe i'm overlooking something, so, please speak up if you think it's a bad idea!
>
> i never used guix pack, but maybe that also deserves a --file argument?

Good point.  ‘--file’ predates ‘--manifest’; we could perhaps deprecate
‘--file’ in favor of ‘--manifest’, though I think there’s one special
case not handled elsewhere:

  guix build -f foo.json

We need to do something about it.

‘guix environment --load’ could be similarly deprecated, either to be
eventually removed or to be renamed to ‘--file’.

Thoughts?

Ludo’.

Re: guix environment --load vs. --file inconsistency

[zimoun]

Hi,

On Thu, 23 Sept 2021 at 22:49, Ludovic Courtès <ludo@gnu.org> wrote:

> ‘guix environment --load’ could be similarly deprecated, either to be
> eventually removed or to be renamed to ‘--file’.

I would like to point this really really long thread [1] about
modifying the CLI vs backward compatibilities.

1: <http://issues.guix.gnu.org/38529>

Cheers,
simon

Re: guix environment --load vs. --file inconsistency

[Robin Templeton]

Ludovic Courtès <ludo@gnu.org> writes:

> Hi Attila,
>
> Attila Lendvai <attila@lendvai.name> skribis:
>
>> i was writing the documentation of a guix.scm file, and i realized that there's an inconsistency among the three most used commands in this context:
>>
>> so, there's:
>> - guix build --file
>> - guix package --file
>>
>> and then there's:
>> - guix environment --load
>> - guix pack # has neither
>>
>> i'd propose to change guix environment to also use --file, but maybe i'm overlooking something, so, please speak up if you think it's a bad idea!
>>
>> i never used guix pack, but maybe that also deserves a --file argument?
>
> Good point.  ‘--file’ predates ‘--manifest’; we could perhaps deprecate
> ‘--file’ in favor of ‘--manifest’, though I think there’s one special
> case not handled elsewhere:
>
>   guix build -f foo.json
>
> We need to do something about it.
>
> ‘guix environment --load’ could be similarly deprecated, either to be
> eventually removed or to be renamed to ‘--file’.
>
> Thoughts?

FWIW, I use 'guix build -f' all the time, 'guix package -f'
occasionally, and 'guix environment -l' once in a while, too -- much
more frequently than the manifest-oriented versions. (And I do find it
confusing that 'environment' uses '-l' rather than '-f'; IMHO it would
be a nice improvement for UI consistency to have '-f'/'--file' permitted
as an alternative for '-l'/'--load' there.) I often write simple
packages in individual files, outside of the guix repo or any kind of
proper channel setup, and I don't see much point in requiring every such
package to have its own single-package manifest, although it wouldn't be
too difficult if it were required (just extra boilerplate for standalone
package files).

Re: guix environment --load vs. --file inconsistency

[Attila Lendvai]

> as an alternative for '-l'/'--load' there.) I often write simple
> packages in individual files, outside of the guix repo or any kind of
> proper channel setup, and I don't see much point in requiring every such
> package to have its own single-package manifest, although it wouldn't be
> too difficult if it were required (just extra boilerplate for standalone
> package files).


FWIW, i'm new to Guix, and it was enough to read the --help output to
understand how --file works, but i still don't know what manifests are
(even though i'm regularly using `guix package -m
/path/to/manifest.scm`, which i have copied from somewhere).

i know where it's documented. what i'm talking about here is how to
optimize the results/time ratio of the project for newcomers; IOW, the
project's approachability. i just haven't gotten to reading up on
manifests, and yet i'm already getting things done.

- attila
PGP: 5D5F 45C7 DFCD 0A39

Re: guix environment --load vs. --file inconsistency

[Ludovic Courtès]

Hi Robin & Attila,

Attila Lendvai <attila@lendvai.name> skribis:

> FWIW, i'm new to Guix, and it was enough to read the --help output to
> understand how --file works, but i still don't know what manifests are
> (even though i'm regularly using `guix package -m
> /path/to/manifest.scm`, which i have copied from somewhere).
>
> i know where it's documented. what i'm talking about here is how to
> optimize the results/time ratio of the project for newcomers; IOW, the
> project's approachability. i just haven't gotten to reading up on
> manifests, and yet i'm already getting things done.

Alright, I hadn’t seen it from that perspective, but that makes a lot of
sense.

Thanks for your feedback,
Ludo’.

PS: <https://guix.gnu.org/guix-refcard.pdf> hopefully contains enough
    about manifests to get you started.