From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp12.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id sLRhFoSerGIeXQAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Fri, 17 Jun 2022 17:32:20 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp12.migadu.com with LMTPS id 6D0ZFoSerGJ5YwEAauVa8A (envelope-from ) for ; Fri, 17 Jun 2022 17:32:20 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EF69BAC66 for ; Fri, 17 Jun 2022 17:32:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:44822 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1o2DxL-00064x-54 for larch@yhetil.org; Fri, 17 Jun 2022 11:32:19 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50602) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1o2Dwk-000630-Lb for guix-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 17 Jun 2022 11:31:43 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:36712) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1o2Dwg-0006eG-2w; Fri, 17 Jun 2022 11:31:41 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Date:References:Subject:To: From; bh=cWyaLdJ+SmLiI/fqRn1EZXnkQSq+P33YvwJ+A7lgKzM=; b=Qf8AiasHgf05yNPXOR/e RmxpCiVZQOf4xiFGzr8+hHLn0fexkLBbQiigoo4z1eCgguZJAwQjBYvkUceps+Mgb8d/goXVUCQ3E DBqMpxdoEgmB/WkGllmkFx0tYEDQ5BWE8VkspBmSA2ImhJjY4ckSC+eGdsmBRxZiShlreuDKyYvAc oWsb3HF5XU3Yeo5f7sORAOxpvLuwbB6rn8AZ9IGljJ3XpHgQ1fOOQjaf/hhf3A752sfq6lg7+LmKE mo9qgBS0Oz59WN3cMR0N7WXqnz1HHb2FH4GKQuotJdVHGyvCMB6TFryi0XYWiUCHeFjPl/d3SdPia DmRwW4TOxo4lYg==; Received: from [193.50.110.205] (port=42808 helo=ribbon) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1o2Dwd-0007Qj-PT; Fri, 17 Jun 2022 11:31:37 -0400 From: =?utf-8?Q?Ludovic_Court=C3=A8s?= To: Josselin Poiret Cc: zimoun , Guix Devel , GNU Guix maintainers Subject: Re: Release v1.4? References: <86bkvckcgr.fsf@gmail.com> <87y1yditsq.fsf@gnu.org> <87edzwwmfe.fsf@jpoiret.xyz> <87letyux19.fsf@gnu.org> <87mted7zm4.fsf@jpoiret.xyz> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: Nonidi 29 Prairial an 230 de la =?utf-8?Q?R=C3=A9vol?= =?utf-8?Q?ution=2C?= jour de la Pivoine X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x090B11993D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-pc-linux-gnu Date: Fri, 17 Jun 2022 17:31:33 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87mted7zm4.fsf@jpoiret.xyz> (Josselin Poiret's message of "Thu, 16 Jun 2022 10:59:31 +0200") Message-ID: <87bkurfgru.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.1 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1655479940; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=cWyaLdJ+SmLiI/fqRn1EZXnkQSq+P33YvwJ+A7lgKzM=; b=NaerjPQtvVhtiDrdoC2woZsuBEt22NtkxXaqRtm0NiBgUWEdGpRX/+MQ5ZvKhg/wUm13Lq mACdEH6OlfoK4GM59Xkl79KDPmdKIoJdMCWSbSrPclWCCX17rjUuiW3fuirRpZtc9bErGt OXRsW0EkUnM6BUPGlgczdkJAGsUVUnnSyrOaKSzoySQmOlQ2ntExMtpsV2rS0rMPiQaIXt u9tUlua/xug37IlqvU5zAMN+cyrt4bE/r/Bz0SUXF87fnujZwhNtzoMy0eXWBxJugA4dFi Jqlkf10cc5bRM2l5DmdVdpvVfQpSJIyYmyPDAgX3l9omA85XuR8hLHnPfAep3g== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1655479940; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=qS5juWCTddGqrdVZNmHrQWX9EvihIX29L/CbWQFjNASky40U7UgYxJAtmHp7DnH/vRHOl9 +mR90tkfIYrcX1uKj1AQYoOgOXI4lD/Wg652bTcS3aBC2fO8txexaNFnPQ3aHecls6oiZJ h9t14GBzdL9Ijpa64YPA8syvRo2FPXolnQKbYa403kDapHL0PtbY9SxdPXZRMcDy8DQmby jX9MI/1EnEpv1G7YUuuA88Pb5J2xBOT+mhxM5BGOzoJTXClPZBmG/mn84c9K6qhj27SkcV KXpI/W/IrZE0vYYPFFDwfTBiQdkPqKucl5Y7o1as7Zv1q5+r2WjtwFo7OeOQZA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gnu.org header.s=fencepost-gnu-org header.b=Qf8AiasH; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -8.49 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gnu.org header.s=fencepost-gnu-org header.b=Qf8AiasH; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: EF69BAC66 X-Spam-Score: -8.49 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: xsXphIIQTwsk Hi, Josselin Poiret skribis: > I'm not sure, it does seem like a fraction of people use it on IRC but > then again it's more likely that Wayland users would talk about it, X > being the default. If there are no outstanding bugs with Wayland Gnome > though, I think it'd be a better choice: no tearing in the default > configuration, and better designed. GUI Toolkits seem to have adapted > pretty well, and we still have XWayland for the rest. The most glaring > non-Wayland app would be Emacs, but emacs-next-pgtk is fully > Wayland-native. So plain =E2=80=98emacs=E2=80=99 package doesn=E2=80=99t work on Wayland? = That sounds like a recipe for a poor user experience, no? (FWIW folks like me who use exwm, ratpoison, or one of these geeky tiling window managers probably can=E2=80=99t switch.) > For me the #1 reason though is onboarding experience: take a user of > another distro that uses their favorite Wayland compositor, and wants to > try out Guix. They install it through the Guix installer, and don't > understand (yet) how to read the whole documentation and write their own > config file fully. They add sway to their system packages, reconfigure, > but next reboot GDM doesn't show Sway in the available sessions; they then > decide it's not worth their time and go back to their old distro. This > default change would make sure that it Just Works Out of The Box=E2=84=A2= on > first install. Yeah, understood. (I think we should have a section in the manual documenting, with actual examples, how to set up Wayland!) Surely there=E2=80=99s a geek audience who expects Wayland, and another geek audience who needs X for their tools; in between, there=E2=80=99s probably = a lot of people who=E2=80=99s fine either way. I have no objection to defaulting to Wayland, but my gut feeling is that we have enough on our plate for 1.4 already, so I=E2=80=99d rather delay th= at post-release. WDYT? Ludo=E2=80=99.