Re: On being welcoming

[Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber@dustycloud.org>]

Niels Möller writes:

> ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic Courtès) writes:
>
>> I dare say that technical expertise does not excuse disdain and
>> contempt.  This behavior is actively harmful to GMP and GNU.
>
> Some developers may be more polite than others, but you really need to
> follow the bug reporting instructions. If it is a bug in gmp, we'd like
> to fix it, of course. Or if it's a configuration error, we'd like to
> resolve that too, but then we still need to start with the proper bug
> reporting information.

Certainly that's true, though of course a "please file this upstream in
GMP, we'd really like to handle it there" would be a nice way to handle
things.  And of course hashing out what's happening locally is not
unusual behavior; Debian does much work to determine whether a bug is a
Debian-local issue or if it is an upstream issue, and if so (hopefully)
file and resolve upstream.  It is not always a perfect process, but Guix
is also a distribution, and it's unsurprising that some conversation
would likely happen here first.

I doubt that Ludovic would have been opposed to filing upstream if the
upstream developers encouraged that... I don't think that was the issue
here.

>> It also illustrates why codes of conduct are more than a cosmetic
>> gimmick.
>
> I'd prefer not to not have the general code-of-conduct-debate on the
> gmp-bugs list.

Sure, though this conversation was on the Guix list.

> If you are disappointed about any individual's behaviour, I suspect it's
> usually more productive to start by trying to solve it off list (maybe
> you did? I wouldn't know of course). Mailing list discussons about
> personal issues tend to overheat too easily.

Sometimes that's true, and I agree, contacting an individual off-list is
usually the first line to handle, especially for smaller issues.  In
general, I think this is the best approach to get good community
interaction.  I don't know if it happened or not.

Though sometimes it is good to give a reply on-list, even in the first
instance, so that it can be clear to a community what behavior is and
isn't okay.

> (And it has taken me more than 30 minutes to formulate this reply, which
> I hope is sufficiently polite and respectful. I really hope that was time
> well spent).

I thought it was very polite and respectful, thank you!

 - Chris

> Best regards,
> /Niels