From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp12.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id GN8pIIbExmNQCwAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 17 Jan 2023 16:53:42 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp12.migadu.com with LMTPS id MOgSIIbExmOHcAEAauVa8A (envelope-from ) for ; Tue, 17 Jan 2023 16:53:42 +0100 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5E27617AF8 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 2023 16:53:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pHoH6-0007el-KF; Tue, 17 Jan 2023 10:53:25 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pHoH3-0007bc-0q for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Jan 2023 10:53:21 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pHoH2-0000VV-Lx; Tue, 17 Jan 2023 10:53:20 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Date:References:Subject:To: From; bh=FGqDmWU84VwrTmLcEVn9slebTaZ/51fdotMJ2oD27lw=; b=Qlm+XEw3EXnTviPe7dmr kDc+b1Y7nrIuAD1AxZtbUlQkI0LUcTCXrd6QT8MP35sMtb9VEe6HYgkJXjhfZ3qwqXhrZw9d0B4OH 0WMaXGcegT0e5Atc0mNKEJ2agcMynT3dNJW5GQtP3E68hbq47GdEXFAZwojcvM0fdZJdyZ263nr2q V7ctCbdcvMwE09XaxSd0NRlV9ZQEj6yyqTdSd/KGTYXPmGbHmZ6WbZtVxHKnK2HSelMlXXdKGpUYN m7Jf+JKWJLs/mjxGEqnfDiuwGKYBhqH3nEu8oz+yJto85y3I/W+x3V/wBAr3pPxRi2kGppPihdaIw ev8arqXxKIIFig==; Received: from [193.50.110.246] (helo=ribbon) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pHoH0-00046c-VK; Tue, 17 Jan 2023 10:53:19 -0500 From: =?utf-8?Q?Ludovic_Court=C3=A8s?= To: Carl Dong Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Subject: Re: Reproducible Containers Paper References: <2D2CE548-0FF4-4D2B-A466-328D99835B4F@carldong.me> X-URL: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ X-Revolutionary-Date: Octidi 28 =?utf-8?Q?Niv=C3=B4se?= an 231 de la =?utf-8?Q?R=C3=A9volution=2C?= jour du Zinc X-PGP-Key-ID: 0x090B11993D9AEBB5 X-PGP-Key: http://www.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/ludovic.asc X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3CE4 6455 8A84 FDC6 9DB4 0CFB 090B 1199 3D9A EBB5 X-OS: x86_64-pc-linux-gnu Date: Tue, 17 Jan 2023 16:53:16 +0100 In-Reply-To: <2D2CE548-0FF4-4D2B-A466-328D99835B4F@carldong.me> (Carl Dong's message of "Sun, 8 Jan 2023 17:56:30 -0800") Message-ID: <87a62hf98z.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gnu.org header.s=fencepost-gnu-org header.b=Qlm+XEw3; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1673970822; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=UyVP0KDlaU8xBlbf/TBUzXbZR0zUbHwyvZhPtLp0XOaYle4MUYjXir2NCPI2cYbFVfQrw1 yIoTeO7ROKbBjByiDQ8c2C5L4rLlJ2/Ytzd7M2Iw/Djgtl0xP4RECxSz8kVqLFSrVV0h+w beC5vnfucTVL5pK3sclnEgBq/ieAc12HNB1TVrETy9B4po8nLo7xBEDPvMYXCYqB6Ff+S6 kqNIsF4UbUu04cBuXARXalxZw26y/cYQ674QjwYvHYKTl6+nhBP6Y988Wj0ZytCB3ECJHu 9PyBH9VPoXyRvRUbiaYMSS10/PVATYYZiWxpNACFfbnQJBqsaRUVnCrx8drGYQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1673970822; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=FGqDmWU84VwrTmLcEVn9slebTaZ/51fdotMJ2oD27lw=; b=Y862hWIjXI+S29Oc0TuFT/YG9uL90BllkcHYDhXoDKomURq81rKgmVmMkPavp3Yf49QMZb 4EreGBOPa2YS2Z/p+YBaukKnfU06wI+cxtNUyqwpBWI3hV8RwyIBCkG/7j3h8k0ZFyUZMy pkAlatDtWBCMqArYa2AQpWJkYjk76ajm/Vd4Hz1do3s5Ie5cu3QyYqK2HzHnQWC2hWTzy9 I/qJxLZqSd6Heouh7Ze+qmPIIATLqCQyvTJswEnj7gRETv7U6fRXsPAoAanB6t+KhfdXkO wPSo7W1MpkF/lgqAOxUMDip+QTC/EOVOcq1p7+Le02nsxcdr6MWbJMnvKoYKCQ== Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gnu.org header.s=fencepost-gnu-org header.b=Qlm+XEw3; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -7.59 X-Spam-Score: -7.59 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 5E27617AF8 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: Kku450uBNlm/ Hi Carl, Carl Dong skribis: > The paper is titled "Reproducible Containers=E2=80=9D: https://dl.acm.org= /doi/pdf/10.1145/3373376.3378519, featured by Meta in their post: https://d= evelopers.facebook.com/blog/post/2022/11/22/hermit-deterministic-linux-test= ing/ Interesting! Probably a sledgehammer for reproducible builds=E2=80=A6 exce= pt perhaps for timestamp issues, as you write. > I was thinking about this in terms of how to have timestamp reproducibili= ty inside Guix build containers which has been a problem in the past for bu= ilding from source, their approach in 5.3 is interesting (but perhaps a bit= invasive). Yes, this bit is interesting: To ensure airtight interception of vDSO calls, DetTrace instead, just after each execve system call, replaces the vDSO library code with our implementation where each vDSO function makes a direct system call=E2=80=94which is duly intercepted via ptrace. We furthermore make the vvar page unreadable to prohibit any access to the raw nondeterministic data that vDSO timing calls use. I wonder what this entails exactly, and whether one needs to ptrace every single process to intercept exec calls in child processes, which would be prohibitive. Thanks for sharing! Ludo=E2=80=99.