From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp2.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:403:4876::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms8.migadu.com with LMTPS id QEIPAG4xvGW4PAAAe85BDQ:P1 (envelope-from ) for ; Fri, 02 Feb 2024 01:03:58 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:403:4876::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp2.migadu.com with LMTPS id QEIPAG4xvGW4PAAAe85BDQ (envelope-from ) for ; Fri, 02 Feb 2024 01:03:58 +0100 X-Envelope-To: larch@yhetil.org Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=zancanaro.id.au header.s=k1 header.b=CrXPUssv; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=zancanaro.id.au; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1706832237; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=dteTCMPhf98ILXwdpzroIpw1U9QSY3BEJ2wnxMyHyVOUcbAeyDcQKziUkoiexgcSkoCrAv TzbvDAtF0J02GncBnDjQMeA5fFZ4n3tlpxyaD2AXo83YQwDm3nOoTmxS/30eITR1dnlF/k usWKGG+52zUWKsKAQPVwUza9sMcEYFjGD65AHznkMm1iZ7wNO57oyVKmgYJIJIgSzarCCO AElxHKLzxwZhlXCHcCeZhPFq/Pnw7Hd6Vle5pUmZYUDkgKO/Ib7u95u7QfAdhn4DeLZxRL K4OGe4MVXbkHasd/9frIHG9CiePbfBfGm/XqnD9JJ5B2wsGr4z6PYry39a9OMw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=zancanaro.id.au header.s=k1 header.b=CrXPUssv; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=zancanaro.id.au; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1706832237; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=mSXR6axWQoJo6x0XzLTT/OLOEbn0WJkW2aNAeOFb2Z8=; b=gPtdfyg821bN8IywQxT//bLDn11KKl7bYOFq/t4FXmHVfyqJ0KlLCkr86+xU7tBxbJaG3J aueBIjx5W/+r2PuzNQE6M2BeC2cDb6ysgRcjXTpRQ62CXfncpVZ2wKZog8A+W4YDYy2D9g nhwV1ZQjKGudeMF4YaGAJSCrL+oFZkaHDWBvaHtDlHlF525nr3cjCfwVSw+QbLw88vnAaQ 5+pI+Zz6keDVffBfOvSTRKEHxiX4HUbFBoVz2dUgKRIO3obrZeo4K5jMGs8Yvf8NXYaQBk oBHUfaZt3/aB1dMlRHB9zvzeVJmGaE+0An26uAqITSEKhsXHrJOSCTBPfcq6qg== Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D8C3023C6B for ; Fri, 2 Feb 2024 01:03:57 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rVh1i-0000sr-OY; Thu, 01 Feb 2024 19:03:26 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rVh1h-0000rw-1h for guix-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2024 19:03:25 -0500 Received: from voltorb.zancanaro.id.au ([45.77.50.64]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rVh1e-0002Bo-1V; Thu, 01 Feb 2024 19:03:24 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; s=k1; bh=mSXR6axWQoJo6x0 XzLTT/OLOEbn0WJkW2aNAeOFb2Z8=; h=date:references:in-reply-to:subject: cc:to:from; d=zancanaro.id.au; b=CrXPUssv5260c1GFinySIWG+aK85/akxqgnrV ZgkhgYfzZcKUPP4rjsYsXWTe2RoP36eZz/S3uDPARGB95cI2HbECL9Smv+JgRqS09TU88E ESGhinPKrHc7goHm/3xy+Mb/CQW6NkrRzTazHO4TUmrC3bkXS5+jVXjiTpDKuKUg= Received: by voltorb.zancanaro.id.au (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 2613fa07 (TLSv1.3:TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256:NO); Fri, 2 Feb 2024 00:03:12 +0000 (UTC) From: Carlo Zancanaro To: Felix Lechner via "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." Cc: Attila Lendvai , Felix Lechner , Liliana Marie Prikler , Edouard Klein , Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= , Josselin Poiret Subject: Re: Introducing Guix "Features"! In-Reply-To: <87frycl3cm.fsf@lease-up.com> (Felix Lechner via's message of "Thu, 01 Feb 2024 05:29:45 -0800") References: <87wn377rst.fsf@rdklein.fr> <877cm6reum.fsf@rdklein.fr> <52c2337b277721108e5e7cdd6ea32e37e3c20628.camel@gmail.com> <8734wsqwrh.fsf@rdklein.fr> <33976deaf13ce785edefa6ac1b3610054dd4a031.camel@gmail.com> <87v89op6f2.fsf@rdklein.fr> <87ttp4jfiy.fsf@lease-up.com> <4H69vnQJrUA5WrVPVfQknwCz2ymq8NFyOnp0cCuqZiUVpSAwp6QAhonzbnSpsuRZJcZUX4dmV-U-qhV7CXNH5UOaGV8IEaL2fY8qXmPnmns=@lendvai.name> <87frycl3cm.fsf@lease-up.com> Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2024 11:03:13 +1100 Message-ID: <8734ubpwam.fsf@zancanaro.id.au> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=45.77.50.64; envelope-from=carlo@zancanaro.id.au; helo=voltorb.zancanaro.id.au X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Scanner: mx10.migadu.com X-Spam-Score: -4.16 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: D8C3023C6B X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.16 X-TUID: RhNpB0EOS9vG On Thu, Feb 01 2024, Felix Lechner via "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." wrote: > On Thu, Nov 30 2023, Attila Lendvai wrote: >> the use of 'service' to describe two rather different abstractions: a >> component of an OS vs. a deamon process run by shepherd. > > Indeed, the use of 'service' in much of Guix appears to be a grand > misnomer. It probably occurred because the meaning expanded over time. We can actually point to a specific moment when the meaning was expanded. It was done in Guix 0.9.0: https://guix.gnu.org/en/blog/2015/gnu-guix-090-released/ Here is a blog post introducing services back in 2015, which has a heading "Services Beyond Daemons" which discusses the change to broaden the term to encompass what Guix now calls a service: https://guix.gnu.org/en/blog/2015/service-composition-in-guixsd/ There is also a talk that Ludovic gave at FOSDEM 2017 where he discusses the ideas of Guix services (I can't remember the content of this, but it seemed like it might be relevant): https://archive.fosdem.org/2017/schedule/event/composingsystemservicesinguixsd/ This doesn't seem like accidental concept creep. This was an intentional decision to use the word "service" to mean something specific. I say this to note that any argument to change the term should first understand why this decision was made (see: Chesterton's Fence). Carlo