From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp2 ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id kKrROf41ymC2PQEAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 16 Jun 2021 19:33:50 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:4a6f::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp2 with LMTPS id +ClONf41ymBvQgAAB5/wlQ (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 16 Jun 2021 17:33:50 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 821C824F7B for ; Wed, 16 Jun 2021 19:33:50 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:34816 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ltZQD-0008Ec-JO for larch@yhetil.org; Wed, 16 Jun 2021 13:33:49 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:55982) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ltZPg-0007kF-8F for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Jun 2021 13:33:16 -0400 Received: from world.peace.net ([64.112.178.59]:49300) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ltZPY-0007SN-V9 for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Jun 2021 13:33:15 -0400 Received: from mhw by world.peace.net with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1ltZPT-0004Wo-Od; Wed, 16 Jun 2021 13:33:03 -0400 From: Mark H Weaver To: Leo Famulari , Leo Prikler Subject: Re: Telemetry on by default kitty In-Reply-To: References: <87czsq7oyl.fsf@disroot.org> <87bl8a92r4.fsf@nckx> <83e3ea6de4daa14a81c826d9200941719abe2f82.camel@student.tugraz.at> <877diy7c7w.fsf@disroot.org> <2e8ede06b4786e4604269b9a7a4a5f04b154040e.camel@student.tugraz.at> <05c05536dde5660ada17b9f4dc8dc041272c1a4a.camel@student.tugraz.at> <87a6nrnirc.fsf@xelera.eu> <9eb0df887ada7e2135206a4f6f6df40e37bc1ac4.camel@student.tugraz.at> Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2021 13:32:04 -0400 Message-ID: <871r91n2a8.fsf@netris.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=64.112.178.59; envelope-from=mhw@netris.org; helo=world.peace.net X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1623864830; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=uE8KUQRc9oyFJZxkZmWuqZXQFn3jOKIGLoaReOqAgFo=; b=RhE4N59n3sycDCjKbFGrbHKPT6LLENvNBUWEgJL1oUDHzq0CWsxw8cEZvO635ZtsjLdjGF WUqgYmVFouSkXBhWE8SVNgPiGTjpyTjotEAWaGTem7hSj9xmf65PfxH1PRhM3gJy88XnMx SeirRiH6DcwBsv/VPX93OkCwyy+yVoQ2tk62ozqMLyLbyrEv2k8izUqjsCIlTawegBsV4+ KciKUe9ft3i78YobAZlgGQnsIFJhRW2d+fXh/hkIXthjQZNAN50Fl2EWWet3INZG+QvdHm v8ApTghVh/JwmDZAV47APA/3+nBplI+YuMrugE4Zp+MjREq0MldjlFLBSgbw5w== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1623864830; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=JEa4hf5AJzkCbDZ23pnp+juIB8M36RpUJMidK2M9bnxh/FN5K3FFbUClQjDKz7XApr+gS5 1pf0GWWxt/1uv0Pgyr88Eoy4WMNUQgK7VzKIoW9YthGMe32ysVZmxTyZhf6EZlYbb9zIGK YgrnfY+0QScAEcdT52FIeoliHEGtjHwvGMAgk8dmMe8DQGvfClkMLM98h0fcKzKjmLP+Ui wUMAj0CzrIZyjj/CR5/c0TXSJBB4E4ewM0ZRP2Py9kct/L4FwDBLXXHTfMcYDsW0jHD661 rr3sPdNPiWIXy6erd9MUfyQumhk75rZBTFWJ5BxtwIGJTzDUjyZDJnSa9BtWJw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.42 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 821C824F7B X-Spam-Score: -2.42 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: M/TxeWfaA7hM Hi Leo, Leo Famulari writes: > On Tue, Jun 15, 2021 at 11:39:59PM +0200, Leo Prikler wrote: >> Am Dienstag, den 15.06.2021, 19:24 +0200 schrieb Giovanni Biscuolo: >> > I'm sorry you don't see the point, but=20 > > Good grief... > >> Might be just me, but this phrasing appears a little aggressive given >> the overall tone of the message being=E2=80=A6 a little less so. > > Yeah, indeed. > > Giovanni, please consider that I might "see the point" but I instead > reached a different conclusion, because I have different values and > preferences than you. I guess you feel offended that Giovanni implied that you don't "see the point". There's just one problem: those were the _exact_ words that _you_ used to describe yourself. Leo Famulari wrote: > I don't personally see the point > of treating telemetry as a special case in terms of trust or consent. Giovanni Biscuolo replied (after quoting the words above): > I'm sorry you don't see the point, but please remember [...] and now you respond with indignation: "please consider that I might 'see the point'". You are contradicting yourself. First you say that you don't "see the point", then you are offended that Giovanni implies that you don't "see the point" and ask him to consider that you _might_ "see the point". You can't have it both ways. In my opinion, here you are being far more aggressive in your tone policing than Giovanni has ever been on this list. Mark -- Disinformation flourishes because many people care deeply about injustice but very few check the facts. Ask me about .