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In-Reply-To: <87o7ic65ox.fsf@elephly.net> References: <20230827135726.y33t55w4cvq6zsvb@X-kone> <874jkift8v.fsf@gmail.com> <87o7ic65ox.fsf@elephly.net> Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2023 12:01:18 +0200 Message-ID: <86tts3sm1d.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::333; envelope-from=zimon.toutoune@gmail.com; helo=mail-wm1-x333.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Scanner: mx2.migadu.com X-Spam-Score: -7.07 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 0C3653B496 X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -7.07 X-TUID: oChMkaj4aJ63 Hi Ricardo, all, On Fri, 08 Sep 2023 at 17:27, Ricardo Wurmus wrote: > Now, this is no longer a problem for me because I=E2=80=99ve been writing= so > many commit messages over the years (and because I no longer try to > adhere to some poorly specified format), but it *is* a problem for > people that I=E2=80=99ve mentored. Well, from my point of view, you cannot know if another way to write commit message format would not be a problem either. :-) I think commit message are for communicating and communication implies norms and norms are by definition excluding. Once we have said that, we are locked. :-) Well, somehow, I think Vagrant=E2=80=99s words [1] captures the situation. Somehow, I am paraphrasing using my own words. ;-) IMHO, the questions is not about pros and cons for some non well-defined ChangeLog-like commit format message, but what are the values of the commit messages for the project? If we answer there is no value, then yeah we could use full-free form commit message. Somehow, that=E2=80=99s what the Julia language is doing [= 2]. If we answer there is a value, can we say explicitly which one? Or which ones? And what could be the format that captures these values. For me, the value is first to have a common structure (uniformity similar as coding style), and this common structure then 1. allows to easily navigate through the history and 2. eases the reading for the people who knows the structure. And second the value is something like =C2=AB it forces some discipline on = me by having me review my changes in details and write out what I did =C2=BB as Maxim is describing in [3]. However, this structure comes with friction. It is not possible to have a structure (norm) which is fully without friction. The question is thus: what is the structure that maximize the value and minimize the friction? And the optimum is person-dependant. I think we have a consensus about the complexity for contributing. From my point of view, all the =E2=80=9Ccognitive complexity=E2=80=9D are not eq= ual. Some cognitive loads are totally useless and just pure friction =E2=80=93 the nu= mber of steps for checking and submitting for example =E2=80=93 and it brings no value at all for the project. Other, as commit message format, also leads to some friction but it also brings value for the project. For these latter case, the improvement is not clear for me. Cheers, simon 1: Re: How can we decrease the cognitive overhead for contributors? Vagrant Cascadian Wed, 06 Sep 2023 10:52:45 -0700 id:87h6o7mbo2.fsf@wireframe https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guix-devel/2023-09 https://yhetil.org/guix/87h6o7mbo2.fsf@wireframe 2: https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/commit/70000ac7c3d5d5f21e42555cdf99e699a= 246f8ec 3: Re: How can we decrease the cognitive overhead for contributors? Maxim Cournoyer Mon, 28 Aug 2023 23:00:00 -0400 id:874jkift8v.fsf@gmail.com https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guix-devel/2023-08 https://yhetil.org/guix/874jkift8v.fsf@gmail.com