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Wed, 19 Jun 2024 15:46:09 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=elenq.tech; s=soverin1; t=1718811969; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:autocrypt:autocrypt; bh=89UWhXtprzNrd9lHkbwM2I6pLS/qxxj3cL6NDsbEFVY=; b=n5dSSSFCdB5i3b3tgCdsCxUJD7XYsJinHXWVDy5zZMRQMyXGoRkXY5M+vFa1ZGy08zlb9Z XrjNKk/1BFK120eDPI3YAb4apFDIL/qYQNPld3GHfzI+aRyXFe/y8aex90kd9BD+U4wfdM z8bpoehwj9t5nkPcdpU74cJH+2+ngqo2ualPIJ8uIQrqgIsYsn1CXKg49Fg/XJLG9d5j2/ nSEdMRO6NBnb7ys17fAuzDa4AhjYpDyWKSmMVhjU2rnGLbGNwvDiwhH/jFRNq724RLx8+x GBbdFmQ+AbDwdODtPrDsz0Rg5IC2jmiWKbdbg5mMf0wwzpWIfRxIhsbJpok+5g== Message-ID: <815e3434-19db-2a07-2fed-f7794b7a63d9@elenq.tech> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2024 17:46:08 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Next Steps For the Software Heritage Problem Content-Language: en-US, es-ES, eu To: raingloom@riseup.net, MSavoritias , Simon Tournier , Ian Eure , guix-devel@gnu.org References: <87a5jh74jf.fsf@gmail.com> <20240619121338.71b5f340@fannys.me> <621b39c5af21791286c6a2b6e39c4c1b@riseup.net> From: Ekaitz Zarraga Autocrypt: addr=ekaitz@elenq.tech; 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spampanel-Class: ham Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a10:de80:1:4091:b9e9:221e:0:1; envelope-from=ekaitz@elenq.tech; helo=dane.soverin.net X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -1.06 X-Spam-Score: -1.06 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 251D53894B X-Migadu-Scanner: mx11.migadu.com X-TUID: oWe2f3pJ7d+J On 2024-06-19 12:25, raingloom@riseup.net wrote: > On 2024-06-19 11:54, Efraim Flashner wrote: >> On Wed, Jun 19, 2024 at 12:13:38PM +0300, MSavoritias wrote: >> ... >> One of our packages, dbxfs, left Github a while ago and continued >> development on a different forge. They adjusted their README to disallow >> hosting of their code on Github. Based on this restriction we have >> labeled later versions of the software as non-free and have not updated >> the package. IMO saying that source code cannot be uploaded to SWH would >> fall into the same category. > > No wonder more and more people are growing dissatisfied with the free > software movement. > There are many valid reasons why someone might criticize the Free Software movement and people behind it, but making free software only has 4 simple rules. If you don't comply with them you are not free software anymore. It's as simple as that, and that simple it should be. Free Software gives me the FREEDOM to print the code, make a roll with it and shove it up my ass if I want to (and even distribute my modified copies for other people to do so). The same freedom I have to upload it to github. If you prevent me from doing one or the other you are restricting my freedom and that's defeating the purpose of free software and we cannot consider your code free software anymore. The line is clear, and trying to pretend to be free software while restricting people's freedoms (regardless of what they are) is absurd. The Free Software movement can be labeled (and is often labeled) as a political movement but I'd say it's more of an ethical movement. It's a way to share *values* and the value we share here is freedom. We might or might not share other values, politics, religion or anything, but as long as we put the freedom in the first place we should agree that free software is better than any other software model we have. There are bad actors in the world (say thieves, killers or... GitHub and AI), and we can discuss about how we should deal with them but I don't think the answer is putting our *values* aside but embrace them harder (one value, freedom, in our case). If people is not happy with the Free Software movement because it puts the freedom first, I can only understand it as people being mad about Free Software because it's about software. For other values, we can start other initiatives I may or may not agree more with, but if the value is freedom (in software), I don't think there's any better way to push for it. But trying to disguise other things inside of the Free Software is kind of dishonest. I don't know, maybe I'm just a little bit tired.