From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp1 ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id SDqPAslu8mBNKAEAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 17 Jul 2021 07:46:49 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp1 with LMTPS id KLvYOchu8mDpVAAAbx9fmQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sat, 17 Jul 2021 05:46:48 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B9F68DF3E for ; Sat, 17 Jul 2021 07:46:48 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:50946 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m4d9z-0005SO-Jr for larch@yhetil.org; Sat, 17 Jul 2021 01:46:47 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:35150) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m4d9l-0005SG-Hp for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Jul 2021 01:46:33 -0400 Received: from mail-qt1-x82f.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::82f]:45910) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m4d9k-0001i2-06 for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Jul 2021 01:46:33 -0400 Received: by mail-qt1-x82f.google.com with SMTP id z25so8797922qto.12 for ; Fri, 16 Jul 2021 22:46:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=philipmcgrath.com; s=google; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Ri70ifZpbu9t3G5F23K+vxARgtsjWRGPgTcrEOYGWpA=; b=QQSTbcGSykEwI1RXQe0zZOOSIGRQJK7DFLbzBtiP/x1XdSjzZDK4i1CEzcHLdndHHX GzxFZNkgPzDc1CzR+7WNUHJ0J/io8XML5HxZyeTm1p63VmxBUiwxBFIOzLVHoV093Vb0 EhGbGyWWtLkHNSvuQ/gPfpoBL2F7WJ/kUUAK7NgYCJ/vrdz/RTeReJexQwYmMi/Qa6WB gaoiJL0gxOeLBZb19/ChFRKIoAs811VBwT4saGyRoEMl4ObX3CG/QYUrPjSZ+Hax7RPo 9hwItOc91orE6pVJYEkX/rBpWGNdXUdxhnX6pq0iBT7kTUvBkLOga7r/6FhVicz+fO53 Yfvw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Ri70ifZpbu9t3G5F23K+vxARgtsjWRGPgTcrEOYGWpA=; b=bpAoTYz2I5RdenmsmXC3qfSmByZZkmMtrkbUgLbOxNtZGU0bmIWbja4Ez+1XmmcbLL dD4eXpTxEOFeCMCCT+YY0aAy8hVFidKlyvFrfpqPpAK9XDPBCeT2opF3aAvkZ8EIdtpr y8LcnFp1S3lC5K0tdZ98MKhE+s7BpXvHviMzhWDOCxMuWDPV5kl0t+Og2HAn5JA9s5S3 CZ3gK3WHDXzr5ODsJ5l7xsMSZLEG46b1HegWWbiDSDcFJeoIud40p68kNPIXBeqNypFf 9VfFyMuNz0yr3AJLIX2Y1eIG838iGuXCO50QuLunQgbeeH12so4rIqk5eGPBGNkjVx8m tcrQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5301Ii9cn8W5N1kaCf4OnklwJd3rTwHwEz2SKyq0uZiJVXUcQDe6 sUnp3gQ/Bcdml90KTGvBwiNdrzM5scGCSBTUc9A= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJx8D1J4MFp57otsSSXWhVgngUHNNMlJaaUW9HBZ+tJJpJ6Dczopl+YY+R6LsJwE8Ka3tCGygg== X-Received: by 2002:a05:622a:11cc:: with SMTP id n12mr12217892qtk.363.1626500790138; Fri, 16 Jul 2021 22:46:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Sapientia.local (c-73-125-89-242.hsd1.fl.comcast.net. [73.125.89.242]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id o186sm5013675qke.44.2021.07.16.22.46.29 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 16 Jul 2021 22:46:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: cowsay could attract copyright and trademark enforcement action To: Leo Prikler , Bone Baboon , guix-devel@gnu.org References: <87mtqsjl3y.fsf@disroot.org> <87a6mphubk.fsf@disroot.org> From: Philip McGrath Message-ID: <6f1db8a2-b3b3-5a54-53e8-f54751f8299d@philipmcgrath.com> Date: Sat, 17 Jul 2021 01:46:28 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.11.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received-SPF: neutral client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::82f; envelope-from=philip@philipmcgrath.com; helo=mail-qt1-x82f.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -12 X-Spam_score: -1.3 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.3 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1626500808; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=Ri70ifZpbu9t3G5F23K+vxARgtsjWRGPgTcrEOYGWpA=; b=TrOTuaYP5Cug16XEtYSDCmezVmcGe2tfY8ZTjLRxuXfBlYy3+dfM6zAI4IMCrAL8LFb3Xj 8wNkwTmLUaRqeszPbuCvVg3iYrICRy/wwVJmjSZc+eu+1vHzRQClc0Htblga4mGyK2rJKu OSbXutbRy5gbVwM2UGXkWNPWl4TSRjxGAiME/fdVd9WOwkBFoWJdN1rlABYCrL0UJNNksT Ih/5WP7KduNIqb0nzI/simMBY5q0tK8rNSss8fWbVOv8f5xX1DK3HathwOyDb35enJ2ERg ZeuwYYhn8IgonY/VwFiUrLgldt1jwv9SEvMImzTC1Cch1MwFdYG5epEwivpvTw== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1626500808; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=OYWpH1cmd8L/8vpJkJOo3VPnDwX5brAB8Mk6JqsjVy0ioFTKPBJTPqi9eLrnPl2qzD8sB5 5QMpg3uqnzRUcAWz8LYEsYIr3/w+u6gTVbeYmMPAXwrau3LGvm8SJr+FVPQR9F0mphDaO/ ZxY2UvUAPsq4QX/2RbdVKBlkLTQ+HCqphmXMEPyBh6DnTuc/va5WcwnWjjiIJrvfmp93Gk /nwCs5DcG0o3ZhR9NZplqi0oCQEVVlqUlTLzrSA9oFhTVVYFjCT21pWMJV0BAo4CB+kb2s dJ/14cnLYhY3oWw+kenjHVDhMN9Cp2x2N2wfdvYqju1YYFjroSMuXX0zgcBm7A== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=philipmcgrath.com header.s=google header.b=QQSTbcGS; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.60 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=philipmcgrath.com header.s=google header.b=QQSTbcGS; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: B9F68DF3E X-Spam-Score: -2.60 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: t7RJTAnphisz On 7/16/21 6:26 PM, Leo Prikler wrote:> As others point out, it is debatable whether or not such a trademark > can be enforced, but what we should be discussing -- and I'd be more > than happy to be wrong on this -- is whether or not the cowfiles can be > distributed under GPL-compatible terms/in accordance with the FSDG. These files seem to me to be non-functional data, analogous to game graphics, which the FSDG do not require to have free/libre licenses. Just as firmware is still code, even if it is represented as an array of numbers, I think ASCII art templates are data, even if they are embedded in Perl fragments. (In the Lisp tradition, I think the distinction between code and data is a fuzzy one, but this case seems fairly clear to me.) On the broader issues, I also am not a lawyer, but I would expect all of these files to be protected by the rights of fair use, fair dealing, and other limitations or exceptions to copyright. Limitations and exceptions seem to trademark law also seem to apply. Fair use and analogous rights are vitally important protections of freedom, including software freedom. For example, in the recent case of Google v. Oracle, fair use was the legal right which protected the freedom of the Java APIs. (The decision also left open the possibility that APIs may not be copyrightable at all.) Apparently these files are over 20 years old and have been widely distributed without objections. If Guix were to remove these files, we would implicitly be disagreeing with the apparent community consensus and saying that users do not have the freedom to create, use, or share such cowfiles. That's not a position I think Guix ought to take, especially not against the apparent consensus of the broader free software community. -Philip