From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Alexander Vdolainen Subject: Re: (Really) Free Software future Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2019 22:18:44 +0300 Message-ID: <5f9d3355-0bae-787c-395e-2976c191f05d@vapaa.xyz> References: <20191009065352.GU8197@protected.rcdrun.com> <1c9dc59c-0594-6921-73e8-b173e558b5c3@vapaa.xyz> <20191010023714.GK20430@protected.rcdrun.com> <6343757.2cZvDvYTfs@pc-713> <20191010061705.GH27628@protected.rcdrun.com> <20191010070606.GW27628@protected.rcdrun.com> <8561e1505c3d90c4deb8bdbfb1a20dced6e96066.camel@gnu.org> <3fe3d102-194d-8872-61ef-45337357ca4a@vapaa.xyz> <22d4a960b7ee45c48dcff0ca7afa7d93cf2b81d0.camel@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="qdXpwODgqSTtU7b6pNMyOK419e1QGUVUs" Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:37797) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1iK5rq-0000uL-R3 for Guix-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 14 Oct 2019 15:18:56 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iK5rp-0004bT-4K for Guix-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 14 Oct 2019 15:18:54 -0400 In-Reply-To: <22d4a960b7ee45c48dcff0ca7afa7d93cf2b81d0.camel@gmail.com> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Jesse Gibbons , psmith@gnu.org, svante.signell@gmail.com, Richard Stallman Cc: Guix-devel , gnu-system-discuss@gnu.org This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --qdXpwODgqSTtU7b6pNMyOK419e1QGUVUs Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="WG4sUKvxh2KqkfRT3ibk75hbd1uq22Vqd" --WG4sUKvxh2KqkfRT3ibk75hbd1uq22Vqd Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi again, On 10/14/19 9:59 PM, Jesse Gibbons wrote: > On Mon, 2019-10-14 at 21:32 +0300, Alexander Vdolainen wrote: >> Hi, >> >> On 10/14/19 9:16 PM, Paul Smith wrote: >>> On Mon, 2019-10-14 at 18:52 +0200, Svante Signell wrote: >>>> On Mon, 2019-10-14 at 12:13 -0400, Paul Smith wrote: >>>>> On Mon, 2019-10-14 at 12:07 +0200, Svante Signell wrote: >> >> (skipped) >> >>> For example, no aspect of either GNOME or systemd are proprietary, >>> using the common meaning of the term. Also, "lock-in" usually refers= >>> to software that prevents users from switching to an alternative; GNO= ME >>> and systemd are certainly not lock-in. >> >> I'm afraid but I cannot agree with that. Actually with systemd design >> you have 'lock-in', because in some cases you need to modify a source >> code to support systemd (or you will face something like this - >> https://superuser.com/questions/1372963/how-do-i-keep-systemd-from-kil= ling-my-tmux-sessions). >> Also, a lot of system daemons has eaten by systemd (and to make it wor= ks >> some forks were created like eudev). >> Finally, correct me if I wrong, but GNOME 3.8 and newer requires syste= md >> to run, it's a lock-in isn't it ? > I'm assuming by GNOME you mean gnome-shell. Please let me know if I'm > incorrect. yep. >=20 > Guix has packaged gnome-shell 3.30.2 but has not packaged systemd. > If systemd was a requirement for gnome-shell guix would have had to pac= kage > systemd in order for gnome-shell to compile and/or work, by definition = of > requirement. > gnome-shell builds and works just fine in guix. it's a good point. But as I understood a special fork of logind (elogind or something similar required). > It follows that systemd is not a prerequisite for gnome-shell 3.30.2. yep, you can emulate it somehow :) but, I'm just happy without gnome, let's assume 'gnome case' isn't a lock-in. >=20 > Please consider this a friendly correction :) ok, got it :) >=20 --=20 Alexander Vdolainen, Evil contractor. --WG4sUKvxh2KqkfRT3ibk75hbd1uq22Vqd-- --qdXpwODgqSTtU7b6pNMyOK419e1QGUVUs Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQGzBAEBCAAdFiEEvyKKe3ldp4SYtvzERPbcZkg0M1UFAl2kyhQACgkQRPbcZkg0 M1V1xQwAmOPjwbH41wbZVr3ATm0QVS0rKRpaelER8XWT2z3YyT2RpRx5mq58dV+n pXkemNFL8Bax+UWX85B4cnivL01Jn9Z2o5M37Q8NtEwpF7LEzF7ELCKgr+NKx4s6 80EeR9az/RQZymwoagkj+hGvSt51CUBGXHoaS6n61OPijrvV+ZkpyNGEW4oPT5Ju l+JsuDtylnBmQtFXn7+vI+YXB+KQC8Wfd0+A4T5Lo4I94fNFdRtb1rp0E/06mZuE R1quxHYvRmGqwCR2HTNr6d+jglR7I2l/u9H8qvN/CgwRvKyQTphVh96gwkK9o9ec y734bB+YImLTWziDMbHPCRCpQPxBy24blH/DliMEFLTJ+mxqfWaxgfCcTwQxBS2M AiCLuokxr/TXCg1Chuy+u0YFxEO+BfzOOb5hjq+eaQ+u6obzZYw7LCqsnBRmiOxQ 2arwmtTvrpDO71kmiSVcMEZ0GQO4qPuocaQC0OQyIfvdJ7jIliLB4BmNLwZRgxnw Ch3gKkmy =Ceud -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --qdXpwODgqSTtU7b6pNMyOK419e1QGUVUs--