From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp10.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id 2FtnBdp73GL0rgAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 24 Jul 2022 00:53:14 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp10.migadu.com with LMTPS id IMmVA9p73GLDKAEAG6o9tA (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 24 Jul 2022 00:53:14 +0200 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C94CDB787 for ; Sun, 24 Jul 2022 00:53:13 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:33066 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oFNzj-0006Ic-RO for larch@yhetil.org; Sat, 23 Jul 2022 18:53:11 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:55760) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oFNzL-0006IT-Mv for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 23 Jul 2022 18:52:47 -0400 Received: from knopi.disroot.org ([178.21.23.139]:49722) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oFNzJ-0004SD-O4 for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 23 Jul 2022 18:52:47 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by disroot.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1450640F19; Sun, 24 Jul 2022 00:52:31 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: SPAM Filter at disroot.org Received: from knopi.disroot.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (disroot.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZBNV3Y0hk_p0; Sun, 24 Jul 2022 00:52:30 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2022 22:52:26 +0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=disroot.org; s=mail; t=1658616750; bh=EhJFKquzmabm5YvwAWkzWy4aEVA4MVooGCzvg77uTDM=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References; b=JsY4nDwNQ3fsyp27snNLEqzLHIeB4MxzScMWsryIiUuR7SGH/xFudBW5Sj9jPlXpo i1h+fOsNHWXoc/90AxOSkHW/UvDQJ2ngiP7D8zqzKXL6MHFTqUP951OgDmylwIlUfO SdMbdcyqM7i/WXKVRIRd2YoZ5ZfRXvV8euRLHDSrFkFx/sXUgmelsqyIfxFXQFFR6H Xd9or9GReoPdkYYpwBPHo+o+8QIopWulC4LKx4v/kDLD5+21AqpG2Q0Y+ThBZiD1H3 65C4JffI3fd5XK1gu9FduL1dItkmzg4fk4enTeMH81Gnjn8DZq8W/8foOGYXIvyBlA 2orQxoC+0Zz8A== From: kiasoc5 To: Maxime Devos Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Subject: Re: Guix-devel Digest, Vol 109, Issue 56 Message-ID: <20220723225226.11f9a793@aria> In-Reply-To: <7000e16f-54df-60a6-031f-699ecca64d0d@telenet.be> References: <20220722171209.312e2822@aria> <7000e16f-54df-60a6-031f-699ecca64d0d@telenet.be> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received-SPF: pass client-ip=178.21.23.139; envelope-from=kiasoc5@disroot.org; helo=knopi.disroot.org X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-To: larch@yhetil.org X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1658616793; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=D7ZjHCj1I4J443I7ddGBpQLrxBbCSAL29rCdqVGCsVQ=; b=Yt+ptmag/YRQjY4MMJLe7V/OpPY9OfLWMUkbmWvzk5hxVPuJwCLrQdvyA4o5mWB1Ohy9dN rjEctAzYVjOSjBE/xNfEW/WTm4o2LPHZU48p7B1pJ6lPI7tCUzkuDZc9S+gEbDq/7L3QjG tHi3WsByIMaKN5XR6DtT713LAdNftLUINFdr9SrggK/f/vi0qqi9CLTY2/LZzvQdKMjdLB QmSZLK2GuHuYakB3eJT/+L8yNaoqfI+RaWiTF7fE3/3xv/oRXVVpV2uvsOs+9uavID5b10 4/e7eDmX92yfbExOyAfAD/sH3nRKcGmb4Or5v2Zfd0vq4h5kFx4RhKpV2DLNKg== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1658616793; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=L9/6UOsrftIHm+4zH1A2g5M/gAEuoBWiFTylbUp+SkQX/Idgta706cAGLO7Wkwl38KQmPv mqhVkd75SR5zpk9Je0JFaou1wVCiCMdvuPuDyyrsXUBw3L/KRns1WyVTym6Ct+cXmv3Xk8 9dMDAtj8DDIHuIg9/WyvaLS32UE3UrXTO5cS9cZeEKUjr+6v2fulDu3gH2CbY7iUoiGNaj 8kxtBjEu8/6E5i6uTxztPwgOZNGcORt60RaEkk8FzufwvqrJzvROOWwR/kP5z9vxaF6GN0 dRN7M1M+W1iFC6djkEUI9W7GwS+ICjpN+PdXmSRvvV6+m2tI8QhjBDU/Hwd3jA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=disroot.org header.s=mail header.b=JsY4nDwN; dmarc=pass (policy=quarantine) header.from=disroot.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.43 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=disroot.org header.s=mail header.b=JsY4nDwN; dmarc=pass (policy=quarantine) header.from=disroot.org; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" X-Migadu-Queue-Id: C94CDB787 X-Spam-Score: -4.43 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: hcpl8zftNv9Z On Fri, Jul 22 2022, 07:16:59 PM +0200 Maxime Devos wrote: > On 22-07-2022 19:12, kiasoc5 wrote: > > We could have packages recommend other packages to make this > > discovery easier for users, like Arch's opt-depends. > > This sounds like my previous proposal to me: > > > Alternatively, packages could have an additional set of inputs > > (development-inputs?) for this use case, only added for "guix shell > > -D" and "guix environment", though then the build environment and > > "guix shell -D the-package" would diverge further. > except it has a more precise semantics than Arch's, or did you have > something different in mind? To me as a user, "guix shell -D package" means "install everything to /build/ the package" and "guix shell package" means "install everything to /use/ the package". We could make it even more granular: 1. Minimal dependencies for build time (native-inputs) 2. Maximal dependencies for build time (development-inputs) 3. Minimal dependencies for runtime (inputs + propagated-inputs) 4. Maximal dependencies for runtime (optdepends) Deciding what is minimal/maximal is the issue. For instance should we build manpages, which might pull in more dependencies (Crux omits them)? Should we compile with every optional flag enabled, which also might pull in more dependencies (like Arch)? Perhaps a policy or standard would be helpful to decide how much we need, if we need more levels of distinction.