From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp2 ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id eN2GHlcitWDYMQEAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Mon, 31 May 2021 19:52:23 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp2 with LMTPS id EC7LGVcitWBuJgAAB5/wlQ (envelope-from ) for ; Mon, 31 May 2021 17:52:23 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 200B620D62 for ; Mon, 31 May 2021 19:52:23 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:45436 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lnm5N-0003j1-5A for larch@yhetil.org; Mon, 31 May 2021 13:52:21 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:39758) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lnm16-00083k-1E for guix-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 31 May 2021 13:47:56 -0400 Received: from mail.thebird.nl ([94.142.245.5]:54728) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lnm11-0005Fc-8p for guix-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 31 May 2021 13:47:55 -0400 Received: by mail.thebird.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 8B5FC103E; Mon, 31 May 2021 19:47:48 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 31 May 2021 19:47:48 +0200 From: Pjotr Prins To: Konrad Hinsen Subject: Re: Idea: a meta language for (language) build systems - npm, Racket, Rust cargo Message-ID: <20210531174748.mhaelcqwmo7degfc@thebird.nl> References: <20210530083847.o5ej63obqnzpwnbd@thebird.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: NeoMutt/20170113 (1.7.2) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=94.142.245.5; envelope-from=pjotr2021@thebird.nl; helo=mail.thebird.nl X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: guix-devel Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1622483543; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post; bh=INf0SHqTImCfDDJ6kdnW1LynqRkIC+rJ7pvLZea06Xs=; b=FjX0uVkLoh4Ln2dA2D9KTJ9SBi7+Tb3F4sJyOuis7X28YTeEH8jtJLRSMwk1SwxAwUtAnR A/1u/hL0KZNMnF6LyxrY3CDurBKJcd1WDbhTowkutR08e1CxdfDyY/sP98mG8E/H7D2OCm tOxTtbunte1f3bvMvlhrh39IJyT4eEfBJWEMTaVSZ8FnZLP4OHDE9NgxpGrs54CPROXZbv TfYyzyRNGY/kzQQGVKGoFuPuncUzDRNv9Huqd6UcNAbS7VCCKvOJplPos/qA4J+vkR0yeo AqknE08YiXsOxz+9bvY/8nOAca239a4BWnXRkrodEP0Slqp3ToecPh0y88+arg== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1622483543; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=Uvew26Nsu2DjnpBL5m/5OlJz/Xzq7sNa/6/X4RXGG38uvzaorP0GRzODhabmnhlWOSqk0n 9XhTS2JDJk5FUPzFVxQ5Rz7X9dKSX4OGgvocdLWVyTp6dSPoolTEn4rJSGueyiOxOzS/Cd Sw4/EL+GkXPokItNgc/jtHi2gUxiaNK+CZwBmjf488H3WRAh8wqwco4FIrV6dGU6bqjhws TIVCoWNbcFwlLVcaThw3PRyWsHst7wvzTX5X83lApkmfFpDkxRI8cSffwk4tt/+AWA1Ox8 AxZZU5XdgXi5ct5ZWTHi7JX5zBl6Tcjqy8HaT4TMDkye8/Frl3hqIH8UUbcrNQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.43 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=guix-devel-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 200B620D62 X-Spam-Score: -2.43 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: 96XVvGYSDDI6 On Sun, May 30, 2021 at 09:17:20PM +0200, Konrad Hinsen wrote: > How about pushing all the other package manager towards producing > sexp-packs, and helping them to get there? I have a feeling they won't be that interested ;). My thoughts are that every software package simply consists of files that need to be compiled (if not interpreted) and be copied in place. As Guix takes care of the first and the last - the issue centers around building. The idea is to dress down these language specific builders, such as cargo, so you don't have all the included complexity. A sexp-pack would represent the most simple build instructions to build a package on its own. Now, of course the current guix-builders solve that too. But, what I am proposing is to split out the actual build step into a package definition, so as to present something simpler to Guix. I found a cargo -> ninja converter. It is that kind of idea. Guix would use ninja with rustc instead of cargo. A stripped down cargo could potentially work too - but cargo is a complex beast. A simplified build step would make it easier to troubleshoot these packages. See what I mean? Pj.