Re: “guix --help” should point to https://guix.gnu.org/help/

[Bengt Richter <bokr@bokr.com>]

Hi zimoun, et al,

On +2020-05-15 13:00:58 +0200, zimoun wrote:
> Hi Ricardo,
> 
> On Fri, 15 May 2020 at 12:20, Ricardo Wurmus <rekado@elephly.net> wrote:
> 
> > annoyed by the fact that people turn to Reddit for help with Guix — a
> > venue only very few of us frequent — I wondered if our help channels are
> > visible enough.
> 
> Maybe it is "cultural" or/and "generational" thing and we cannot do
> really better. Maybe some people prefer channels as Reddit because
> they are a bit "afraid" by email and/or IRC, especially maybe on
> official channels.  Maybe because when someone has a problem, the
> first thing they does is a query to popular search engines and then

Habits are habits, but I don't think people specifically needing guix info
would go to popular search engines if they had an obvious better alternative.

I suspect people e.g. go to https://duckduckgo.com/ and type
"site:gnu.org some clues 2020" in the slot because it can be faster
that way to get a good selection of URLS to choose from.

I.e., faster than navigating from the top of http://www.gnu.org/gethelp/
(BTW wondering why the link is not
   https://www.gnu.org/software/gethelp.html
which works fine).

So, shame at having been outperformed in a search? Or an opportunity to extend the
cooperative FLOSS ethos, and maybe contact duckduckgo.com so as to help them
suceed well in helping us, and creating a mesh benefiting all?

Likewise with Arch and Debian and other wikis or forums that can have
useful search capability that it would be helpful for guix.gnu.org to point to.

You may say that users usually know about their own distros' help sites,
but sometimes it can help to know e.g. that a sibling debian descendant does
not have the problem you are experiencing.

> browse some Reddit-kind of channels, so maybe they feels like it is a
> good entry point.  Maybe some people appreciate the voting system
> (upvote, Discourse, etc.) to be "rewarded". Etc..
>

Good point, I definitely think some kind of rating system would help.
Especially if tied into the search data base so that you can easily
sift out information authored by people who typically post the
final authoritative and correct "fixes" with nice succinct rationale :)

> Well, I am not convinced it is an issue about visibility. :-(
>
Well, I am :)
At least visible things are easier to find when you need them.
Of course, in the dark, audible things may be easier to find,
which may be very important to some.

Of course, in a familiar room, touch may be sufficient to
keep your mental model of the room in sync with reality,
and to navigate through it. Touch is easy to overlook, but
really important, whether typing, reading braille,
playing an instrument, or just playing around :)

So an accessible site map, to build that mental model that
makes it a familiar room, is probably a good thing.

> 
> > “guix --help” prints this:
> >
> >   Report bugs to: bug-guix@gnu.org.
> >   GNU Guix home page: <https://guix.gnu.org>
> >   General help using GNU software: <http://www.gnu.org/gethelp/>

Some people might not like to click on http[^s] and wonder why gnu
is not practicing what it preaches, or suspect that their isp is playing
surveillance middle man^H^H^Hperson^H^H^H^H^H^Hagent for some reason?

I'll repeat from above:
(BTW wondering why the link is not
   https://www.gnu.org/software/gethelp.html
which works fine).

> >
> > I think it should explicitly point to https://guix.gnu.org/help/, maybe
> > right before “General help using GNU software”.
>
+1 :)

Also, I think it would be nice if there were a link from https://guix.gnu.org/help/
to a search page with some category checkboxes and radio buttons, so that
you could get rapidly to the _kind_ of search you need or want. E.g.,

"[x] Troubleshooting" ought to be one check-box IMO, for me the most important :)
I think with that checked searches should lead to info re recent regressions
and "popular" troubleshooting topics, and notices of security issues and realease news.
NOT 2017 bikeshed threads or fixes for problems of long-gone generations :)
(unless of course they sadly are still dead-on relevant ;-/ )

Also, ISTM guix.gnu.org should not try to be the only source of information, but rather
help people to get to other GNU-friendly sources of info that may have extra relevant
info for their particular distribution and use case. Links for pursuing that would help.

Sometimes going to duckduckgo.com and typing "site:gnu.org what you want" in the slot
can get you useful urls faster than navigating down from https://guix.gnu.org/help/

I don't think there's any shame in suggesting that :)

 > Yes, it cost nothing and could improve.

I think that's way too unassertive :)

> 
> 
> All the best,
> simon
> 

-- 
Regards,
Bengt Richter