From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: "Raghav Gururajan" Subject: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2020 11:31:07 +0000 Message-ID: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="--=_RainLoop_782_131406601.1578396667" Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:41510) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ion4s-0000w5-Vy for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jan 2020 06:31:16 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ion4r-0002YR-9x for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jan 2020 06:31:14 -0500 Received: from knopi.disroot.org ([178.21.23.139]:38900) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ion4q-0002Xg-Oh for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jan 2020 06:31:13 -0500 List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: guix-devel@gnu.org ----=_RainLoop_782_131406601.1578396667 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello Guix Folks! I would like to contribute to Guix via Outreachy progra= m. Based on domains listed in http://guix.gnu.org/contribute (http://guix= .gnu.org/contribute/), I would like to work on "Packages". After brief di= scussion with Tobias (nckx) on IRC, I came up with following ideas. 1) Im= prove GNOME Software Stack and GNOME Desktop Environment's user-experienc= e in Guix. (a) Revise Package(s): Add missing packages, remove deprecated= packages and fix erroneous packages. (b) Revise Meta-Package(s): Clean-u= p gnome and create gnome-minimal. (c) Revise Package Module(s): Rebase gn= ome.scm and gnome-xyz-.scm into gnome-core.scm, gnome-deps.scm, gnome-sdk= .scm and gnome-extras.scm. (d) Revise Service(s): Add missing services, r= emove deprecated services and fix erroneous services. (e) Revise Service = Module(s): Rebase gnome-dektop-service-type and %desktop-services into gn= ome-desktop-service-type and gnome-minimal-desktop-service-type. 2) Impro= ve Xfce Software Stack and Xfce Desktop Environment's user-experience in = Guix. (a) Revise Package(s): Add missing packages, remove deprecated pack= ages and fix erroneous packages. (b) Revise Meta-Package(s): Clean-up xfc= e and create xfce-minimal. (c) Revise Package Module(s): Rebase xfce.scm = into xfce-core.scm, xfce-apps.scm, xfce-plugins.scm and xfce-bindings.scm= . (d) Revise Service(s): Add missing services, remove deprecated services= and fix erroneous services. (e) Revise Service Module(s): Rebase xfce-de= ktop-service-type and %desktop-services into xfce-desktop-service-type an= d xfce-minimal-desktop-service-type. We can discuss more in detail on IRC= to see the gravity of these ideas and then it can be decided whether to = go with (1) or (2) or both. Please let me know about your thoughts on thi= s. Thank you! Regards, Raghav Gururajan. ----=_RainLoop_782_131406601.1578396667 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<= pre>Hello Guix Folks! I would like to contribute to Guix via Outreachy pr= ogram. Based on domains listed in http://guix.gnu.org/co= ntribute, I would like to work on "Packages". After brief discussion = with Tobias (nckx) on IRC, I came up with following ideas. 1) Improve GNO= ME Software Stack and GNOME Desktop Environment's user-experience in Guix= . (a) Revise Package(s): Add missing packages, remove deprecated packages= and fix erroneous packages. (b) Revise Meta-Package(s): Clean-up gnome a= nd create gnome-minimal. (c) Revise Package Module(s): Rebase gnome.scm a= nd gnome-xyz-.scm into gnome-core.scm, gnome-deps.scm, gnome-sdk.scm and = gnome-extras.scm. (d) Revise Service(s): Add missing services, remove dep= recated services and fix erroneous services. (e) Revise Service Module(s)= : Rebase gnome-dektop-service-type and %desktop-services into gnome-deskt= op-service-type and gnome-minimal-desktop-service-type. 2) Improve Xfce S= oftware Stack and Xfce Desktop Environment's user-experience in Guix. (a)= Revise Package(s): Add missing packages, remove deprecated packages and = fix erroneous packages. (b) Revise Meta-Package(s): Clean-up xfce and cre= ate xfce-minimal. (c) Revise Package Module(s): Rebase xfce.scm into xfce= -core.scm, xfce-apps.scm, xfce-plugins.scm and xfce-bindings.scm. (d) Rev= ise Service(s): Add missing services, remove deprecated services and fix = erroneous services. (e) Revise Service Module(s): Rebase xfce-dektop-serv= ice-type and %desktop-services into xfce-desktop-service-type and xfce-mi= nimal-desktop-service-type. We can discuss more in detail on IRC to see t= he gravity of these ideas and then it can be decided whether to go with (= 1) or (2) or both. Please let me know about your thoughts on this. Thank = you! Regards, Raghav Gururajan.

----=_RainLoop_782_131406601.1578396667-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: "Raghav Gururajan" Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2020 11:32:10 +0000 Message-ID: <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> References: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:41659) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ion5q-0003ZS-Fa for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jan 2020 06:32:15 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ion5p-0002z1-3k for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jan 2020 06:32:14 -0500 Received: from knopi.disroot.org ([178.21.23.139]:57548) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ion5o-0002yd-Tz for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jan 2020 06:32:13 -0500 In-Reply-To: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: guix-devel@gnu.org Hello Guix Folks!=0A=0AI would like to contribute to Guix via Outreachy p= rogram. Based on domains listed in http://guix.gnu.org/contribute, I woul= d like to work on "Packages".=0A=0AAfter brief discussion with Tobias (nc= kx) on IRC, I came up with following ideas.=0A=0A1) Improve GNOME Softwar= e Stack and GNOME Desktop Environment's user-experience in Guix.=0A=0A(a)= Revise Package(s): Add missing packages, remove deprecated packages and = fix erroneous packages.=0A(b) Revise Meta-Package(s): Clean-up gnome and = create gnome-minimal.=0A(c) Revise Package Module(s): Rebase gnome.scm an= d gnome-xyz-.scm into gnome-core.scm, gnome-deps.scm, gnome-sdk.scm and g= nome-extras.scm.=0A(d) Revise Service(s): Add missing services, remove de= precated services and fix erroneous services.=0A(e) Revise Service Module= (s): Rebase gnome-dektop-service-type and %desktop-services into gnome-de= sktop-service-type and gnome-minimal-desktop-service-type.=0A=0A2) Improv= e Xfce Software Stack and Xfce Desktop Environment's user-experience in G= uix.=0A=0A(a) Revise Package(s): Add missing packages, remove deprecated = packages and fix erroneous packages.=0A(b) Revise Meta-Package(s): Clean-= up xfce and create xfce-minimal.=0A(c) Revise Package Module(s): Rebase x= fce.scm into xfce-core.scm, xfce-apps.scm, xfce-plugins.scm and xfce-bind= ings.scm.=0A(d) Revise Service(s): Add missing services, remove deprecate= d services and fix erroneous services.=0A(e) Revise Service Module(s): Re= base xfce-dektop-service-type and %desktop-services into xfce-desktop-ser= vice-type and xfce-minimal-desktop-service-type.=0A=0AWe can discuss more= in detail on IRC to see the gravity of these ideas and then it can be de= cided whether to go with (1) or (2) or both.=0A=0APlease let me know abou= t your thoughts on this.=0A=0AThank you!=0A=0ARegards,=0ARaghav Gururajan= . From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Jan Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2020 19:06:58 +0100 Message-ID: <20200107190658.5f35fcbe@kompiuter> References: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:59322) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1iotG8-000838-Rx for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jan 2020 13:07:18 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iotG7-0001lR-Nx for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jan 2020 13:07:16 -0500 Received: from smtpo.poczta.interia.pl ([217.74.65.236]:38706) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iotG7-0001in-4F for guix-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Jan 2020 13:07:15 -0500 In-Reply-To: <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Raghav Gururajan Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Hi! On Tue, 07 Jan 2020 11:32:10 +0000 "Raghav Gururajan" wrote: > Hello Guix Folks! > > 1) Improve GNOME Software Stack and GNOME Desktop Environment's > user-experience in Guix. > In my opinion we should stay away from GNOME, because it is a Red Hat project, rather than GNU now. More than this, GNOME makes some bad for user freedom decisions, for example they promote nonfree software in their "Software" application. They also promote nonfree services such as Facebook, Google mail, etc. in their "Online accounts" application. They also make some poor design decisions such as adding support for flatpak, which is going to have support for "paid", which most probably means nonfree applications and they add more and more systemd-only features (systemd's problem is feature creep, software bloat, uncooperative developers and merging projects into systemd, without any reason). That's why I would like to see XFCE being improved rather than GNOME. Ideally both GNOME and XFCE should work well on Guix, but if we have to choose between those two, I vote for XFCE. But that's my private opinion, it'd be better, if Guix maintainers told what they think about it. Jan Wielkiewicz From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: "Raghav Gururajan" Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2020 07:06:26 +0000 Message-ID: <8d6e8525703d214f1e4e28dd1afb654e@disroot.org> References: <20200107190658.5f35fcbe@kompiuter> <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44738) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ip5QF-0007RC-Om for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 02:06:33 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ip5QE-0007jl-AG for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 02:06:31 -0500 Received: from knopi.disroot.org ([178.21.23.139]:48736) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ip5QD-0007ht-Jn for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 02:06:30 -0500 In-Reply-To: <20200107190658.5f35fcbe@kompiuter> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Jan Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Hello Jan!=0A=0A> In my opinion we should stay away from GNOME, because i= t is a Red Hat=0A> project, rather than GNU now. More than this, GNOME ma= kes some bad for=0A> user freedom decisions, for example they promote non= free software in=0A> their "Software" application. They also promote nonf= ree services such as=0A> Facebook, Google mail, etc. in their "Online acc= ounts" application.=0A> They also make some poor design decisions such as= adding support for=0A> flatpak, which is going to have support for "paid= ", which most=0A> probably means nonfree applications and they add more a= nd more=0A> systemd-only features (systemd's problem is feature creep, so= ftware=0A> bloat, uncooperative developers and merging projects into syst= emd,=0A> without any reason).=0A=0AYeah, I am too disappointed by some or= half of the things they incorporated into the project. The thing is, I w= ant to bring more newcomers of GNU+Linux System into Guix. I would like t= o see Guix being deployed as mainstream system for domestic and commercia= l purposes. For domestic users, there is a high requirement for graphical= interfaces. Unfortunately, currently we have only GNOME and KDE as full-= blown desktop environments. They both have similar issues regarding softw= are freedom and software creep. GNOME Software, QtWebKIT etc. Also. they= both are tightly integrated redhat creeps such as network-manager, pulse= audio, dbus and systemd. The only reasons for me to lean towards GNOME ov= er KDE, is that 1) Being GNU Project (hope it stays) 2) Being GTK based (= shared dependency with most other free softwares).=0A=0AI also see anothe= r light. Enlightenment. The EFL library is independent of gnome, kde and = redhat related stuffs. It has systemd only as optional dependency. Also u= ses connman over network-manager. May there is some hope here. Once Enlig= htenment grows into drop-in replacement of GNOME or KDE. I will definitel= y be shifting my focus from GNOME to Enlightenment.=0A=0A> That's why I w= ould like to see XFCE being improved rather than=0A> GNOME.=0A=0AI love t= he design principles of Xfce. Modularity and re-usability. The only downs= ide I face with Xfce are 1) Depends on GNOME stuff, dbus etc. 2) Not as f= eature-rich as GNOME or KDE. Anyway, Xfce is good light-weight DE fpr new= -comers. That's why Xfce is still on my hope list.=0A=0A> Ideally both GN= OME and XFCE should work well on Guix, but if we have to=0A> choose betwe= en those two, I vote for XFCE.=0A> =0A> But that's my private opinion, it= 'd be better, if Guix maintainers told=0A> what they think about it.=0A= =0ALet's not constrain ourselves by stating something as just opinion. :-= ) The matters you mentioned are real issues and factually causing trouble= in software freedom. :-)=0A=0ARegards,=0ARG. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: "Raghav Gururajan" Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2020 07:42:27 +0000 Message-ID: <1571a8a7d345509f4e6cbf6ed5ec752a@disroot.org> References: <8d6e8525703d214f1e4e28dd1afb654e@disroot.org> <20200107190658.5f35fcbe@kompiuter> <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38262) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ip5zA-0002z3-9B for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 02:42:37 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ip5z8-0005Vk-Tg for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 02:42:36 -0500 Received: from knopi.disroot.org ([178.21.23.139]:59032) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ip5z8-0005TK-Ej for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 02:42:34 -0500 In-Reply-To: <8d6e8525703d214f1e4e28dd1afb654e@disroot.org> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Jan Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Oh, I forgot mention something in my previous reply.=0A=0AOne more reason= I lean towards GNOME over KDE is because of GNOME Human Interface Guidel= ines.=0A=0A1) Cognitive Ergonomics (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cogniti= ve_ergonomics)=0A2) Human-Computer Interaction (https://en.wikipedia.org/= wiki/Human%E2%80%93computer_interaction)=0A3) Human Interface Guidelines = (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_interface_guidelines)=0A4) GNOME Hum= an Interface Guidelines (https://developer.gnome.org/hig/stable/) From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Efraim Flashner Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2020 12:40:52 +0200 Message-ID: <20200108104052.GA3568@E5400> References: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> <20200107190658.5f35fcbe@kompiuter> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="VS++wcV0S1rZb1Fb" Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50879) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ip8mG-0006GQ-Mu for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 05:41:29 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ip8mF-0004EP-JK for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 05:41:28 -0500 Received: from flashner.co.il ([178.62.234.194]:49972) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ip8mD-0004CA-Ph for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 05:41:26 -0500 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20200107190658.5f35fcbe@kompiuter> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Jan Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org --VS++wcV0S1rZb1Fb Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Jan 07, 2020 at 07:06:58PM +0100, Jan wrote: > Hi! >=20 > On Tue, 07 Jan 2020 11:32:10 +0000 > "Raghav Gururajan" wrote: >=20 > > Hello Guix Folks! > >=20 > > 1) Improve GNOME Software Stack and GNOME Desktop Environment's > > user-experience in Guix. > >=20 > In my opinion we should stay away from GNOME, because it is a Red Hat > project, rather than GNU now. More than this, GNOME makes some bad for > user freedom decisions, for example they promote nonfree software in > their "Software" application. They also promote nonfree services such as > Facebook, Google mail, etc. in their "Online accounts" application. > They also make some poor design decisions such as adding support for > flatpak, which is going to have support for "paid", which most > probably means nonfree applications and they add more and more > systemd-only features (systemd's problem is feature creep, software > bloat, uncooperative developers and merging projects into systemd, > without any reason). > That's why I would like to see XFCE being improved rather than > GNOME. > Ideally both GNOME and XFCE should work well on Guix, but if we have to > choose between those two, I vote for XFCE. >=20 > But that's my private opinion, it'd be better, if Guix maintainers told > what they think about it. >=20 For better or worse Gnome is the dominant desktop in the GNU/Linux market space and we do have it packaged and offer it as part of our default desktop example. Furthermore Raghav has already been working on making Gnome better in Guix. As far as the privacy concerns, those can be addressed on a package-by-package basis but shouldn't be cause to skip it entirely. --=20 Efraim Flashner =D7=90=D7=A4=D7=A8=D7=99=D7=9D = =D7=A4=D7=9C=D7=A9=D7=A0=D7=A8 GPG key =3D A28B F40C 3E55 1372 662D 14F7 41AA E7DC CA3D 8351 Confidentiality cannot be guaranteed on emails sent or received unencrypted --VS++wcV0S1rZb1Fb Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCgAdFiEEoov0DD5VE3JmLRT3Qarn3Mo9g1EFAl4VsbAACgkQQarn3Mo9 g1FoBg/+MMipFFtEJT/8NirxT1LbtHA0m2quUdbn59Hl1AM4PnazhseW2gjc3Fa/ 0bGjc+0TOFvLQ7K0EDr1G6i9JAy53PZbyrJseNdA5zV3YfUppA8+Ze5pypMpyZho lB5aq3PH1yc4Z8B1huMW/hzJw8iWPudUWj1LBF0j1XKoxjkytgiueWdQljPxBzMg yFxPmGUgFPjj6OPiseu2ma0ZR3LV2St6fmJQzITQL/hwuE81Skks+FDCb+WwJ1Qm 10FaZrxy8lIi3x0UqfVihupBLm/o4qaeO5jixVplxVsd4KNJ0023NtsXSYWMjIBb M6j0vvBn4GHQ2g1YhGN6fSbR4cP9WOtnC4ctRAMNpo4qA8pmrKrYxPHNdyQwYSDx suRm9guiMKEH3zzlc5nW2HribmGZLljUMnClukKPoIPJJ2yz/0BG6p7x9aCw4+AV JnyqbCRlN107r/oYff4XfiSbKQ+5b22b5rwQlaJAdw11nNA65KdixNrNmo6OHnHi vYIJFpxiLowqyWEcs2BkAm8lCU2x617vcfqnebgMw4pWMX5JWqxvjb7DHuffm56w lWdIaDExNSSuL3V7Rafs0pTSFlAabA7Y6GPRTyA+1aqQcV7iZRgp+7UialsF1k73 H6WoG4RUjcbrWJtyrE3JqP9n70BHSiobI5WKCyzlZpEaXNjkg4Y= =p88x -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --VS++wcV0S1rZb1Fb-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Jesse Gibbons Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2020 07:59:30 -0700 Message-ID: <0d6cb45309ca6bd949842f22a9fc2f04148b0276.camel@gmail.com> References: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:41915) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ipCo5-0001We-8s for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 09:59:38 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ipCo4-0007My-5w for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 09:59:37 -0500 Received: from mail-pf1-x429.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::429]:33657) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ipCo3-0007Kz-UG for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 09:59:36 -0500 Received: by mail-pf1-x429.google.com with SMTP id z16so1775095pfk.0 for ; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 06:59:33 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Raghav Gururajan , guix-devel@gnu.org On Tue, 2020-01-07 at 11:32 +0000, Raghav Gururajan wrote: > Hello Guix Folks! > > I would like to contribute to Guix via Outreachy program. Based on > domains listed in http://guix.gnu.org/contribute, I would like to > work on "Packages". > > After brief discussion with Tobias (nckx) on IRC, I came up with > following ideas. > > 1) Improve GNOME Software Stack and GNOME Desktop Environment's user- > experience in Guix. ... > (b) Revise Meta-Package(s): Clean-up gnome and create gnome-minimal. ... > 2) Improve Xfce Software Stack and Xfce Desktop Environment's user- > experience in Guix. ... > (b) Revise Meta-Package(s): Clean-up xfce and create xfce-minimal. > Yes! I don't think I'm alone in frustration over unnecessary packages installed systemwide. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Jan Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2020 16:05:23 +0100 Message-ID: <20200108160523.60f1e4f6@kompiuter> References: <20200107190658.5f35fcbe@kompiuter> <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> <8d6e8525703d214f1e4e28dd1afb654e@disroot.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:46457) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ipCtz-0000Oe-Bs for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 10:05:44 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ipCtx-0003FO-Sr for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 10:05:43 -0500 Received: from smtpo.poczta.interia.pl ([217.74.65.236]:51769) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ipCtx-0003CP-8b for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 10:05:41 -0500 In-Reply-To: <8d6e8525703d214f1e4e28dd1afb654e@disroot.org> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Raghav Gururajan Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org On Wed, 08 Jan 2020 07:06:26 +0000 "Raghav Gururajan" wrote: > Hello Jan! > > Yeah, I am too disappointed by some or half of the things they > incorporated into the project. The thing is, I want to bring more > newcomers of GNU+Linux System into Guix. I would like to see Guix > being deployed as mainstream system for domestic and commercial > purposes. For domestic users, there is a high requirement for > graphical interfaces. Unfortunately, currently we have only GNOME and > KDE as full-blown desktop environments. They both have similar issues > regarding software freedom and software creep. GNOME Software, > QtWebKIT etc. Also. they both are tightly integrated redhat creeps > such as network-manager, pulseaudio, dbus and systemd. The only > reasons for me to lean towards GNOME over KDE, is that 1) Being GNU > Project (hope it stays) 2) Being GTK based (shared dependency with > most other free softwares). > Okay then, if it is going to help promoting Guix, I'm okay with this. > > I also see another light. Enlightenment. The EFL library is > independent of gnome, kde and redhat related stuffs. It has systemd > only as optional dependency. Also uses connman over network-manager. > May there is some hope here. Once Enlightenment grows into drop-in > replacement of GNOME or KDE. I will definitely be shifting my focus > from GNOME to Enlightenment. > I found it a bit strange, guess I'll have to write my own DE anyway :) > > I love the design principles of Xfce. Modularity and re-usability. > The only downside I face with Xfce are 1) Depends on GNOME stuff, > dbus etc. 2) Not as feature-rich as GNOME or KDE. Anyway, Xfce is > good light-weight DE fpr new-comers. That's why Xfce is still on my > hope list. > Understandable. > > Let's not constrain ourselves by stating something as just > opinion. :-) The matters you mentioned are real issues and factually > causing trouble in software freedom. :-) > What I meant by this is I can't really make decisions for the whole community, because I'm just a package maintainer. But you're right those are serious issues. > Regards, > RG. Jan Wielkiewicz From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Jan Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2020 16:15:11 +0100 Message-ID: <20200108161511.50ec46e5@kompiuter> References: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> <20200107190658.5f35fcbe@kompiuter> <20200108104052.GA3568@E5400> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:53241) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ipD3L-0003ja-LY for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 10:15:25 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ipD3K-00027t-Bu for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 10:15:23 -0500 Received: from smtpo.poczta.interia.pl ([217.74.65.236]:44371) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ipD3J-00026s-Om for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Jan 2020 10:15:22 -0500 In-Reply-To: <20200108104052.GA3568@E5400> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Efraim Flashner Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org On Wed, 8 Jan 2020 12:40:52 +0200 Efraim Flashner wrote: > > For better or worse Gnome is the dominant desktop in the GNU/Linux > market space and we do have it packaged and offer it as part of our > default desktop example. Furthermore Raghav has already been working > on making Gnome better in Guix. > > As far as the privacy concerns, those can be addressed on a > package-by-package basis but shouldn't be cause to skip it entirely. > I only hope fixing those issues won't take more effort than maintaining our own thing/better alternative one day. It's fine when you can just use configure flags to disable bad features during build time, but what if they start adding proprietary parts to systemd and GNOME will use it even harder? systemd is LGPL'd after all. Embrace, Extend, Extinguish. Jan Wielkiewicz From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Raghav Gururajan Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2020 10:02:56 -0500 Message-ID: References: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> <4961cfee44055bbb285157a76158f274@disroot.org> <0d6cb45309ca6bd949842f22a9fc2f04148b0276.camel@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha256"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-l48r6vbiU3IfzfkKyB1H" Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:39783) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ipXdO-0003ty-Q9 for guix-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jan 2020 08:13:59 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ipXdN-0003oC-Hc for guix-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jan 2020 08:13:58 -0500 Received: from knopi.disroot.org ([178.21.23.139]:36612) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ipXdL-0003jU-0i for guix-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jan 2020 08:13:56 -0500 In-Reply-To: <0d6cb45309ca6bd949842f22a9fc2f04148b0276.camel@gmail.com> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Jesse Gibbons , guix-devel@gnu.org --=-l48r6vbiU3IfzfkKyB1H Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Yes! I don't think I'm alone in frustration over unnecessary packages > installed systemwide.=20 :-) --=-l48r6vbiU3IfzfkKyB1H Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAABCAAdFiEEamFiplxUWgy2NgJiorDiYAVcMdsFAl4V7yAACgkQorDiYAVc MdvYdggAoMAje0gFEfCCPIDw3ztNk5Tg4RbDZwC8shv3CzGeBkrTw6nFmLZG1FL4 N+W+9jxoOnp5RcIiEL9PK7mKP/hVAZU1byyaGILi9iEzpEdLxiV95SuqKVHGVrmz vzGbXguBCUiNB6kU/4vygDI2ekc9/deCoklLsY2BqdkngO4Vo6hkHXloEKfaBRvp EhVtrZQR0JxaJMJSS2otVRRsJO1EsBX6quXGxKSMuvvc0vgak5i6+iayy7FlUHOt rFqkC+zJiQf61W1qkVakuc8Yw/65cmDkD02xppZM6IMmEQmbxpF34VSeujXpr4gR yQa/pIuP8KwZukfX91PYjue89truJg== =UEJT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-l48r6vbiU3IfzfkKyB1H-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Jan Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2020 20:54:09 +0100 Message-ID: <20200109205409.7d69453e@kompiuter> References: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:41267) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ipdt0-0006NF-LQ for guix-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jan 2020 14:54:32 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ipdsz-0006Zd-C2 for guix-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jan 2020 14:54:30 -0500 Received: from smtpo.poczta.interia.pl ([217.74.65.235]:41669) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ipdsy-0006G0-NB for guix-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jan 2020 14:54:29 -0500 In-Reply-To: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Raghav Gururajan Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Don't know if this is a good place, but gnome-color-manager in this commit: https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/guix.git/commit/?id=29ae18db0578bbdbc0119703f7412fe91927e80e has GPL2 license in the "license" field and the COPYING file also tells the license is GPL2, but if you check a random source file, for example https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-color-manager/blob/master/src/gcm-brightness.c Then files are licensed under GPL2 or any later. > * This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify > * it under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by > * the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or > * (at your option) any later version. I guess the license is GPLV2 then, but I'm not sure, can someone confirm this? Jan Wielkiewicz From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: =?utf-8?Q?Ludovic_Court=C3=A8s?= Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2020 00:39:55 +0100 Message-ID: <87tv51sgtw.fsf@gnu.org> References: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> <20200109205409.7d69453e@kompiuter> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:34653) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1iqQMJ-0002Bd-MW for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 11 Jan 2020 18:40:00 -0500 In-Reply-To: <20200109205409.7d69453e@kompiuter> (Jan's message of "Thu, 9 Jan 2020 20:54:09 +0100") List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Jan Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org Hi, Jan skribis: > Don't know if this is a good place, but gnome-color-manager in this > commit: > https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/guix.git/commit/?id=3D29ae18db0578bbdbc= 0119703f7412fe91927e80e > has GPL2 license in the "license" field and the COPYING file also tells > the license is GPL2, but if you check a random source file, for example > https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-color-manager/blob/master/src/gcm-br= ightness.c > Then files are licensed under GPL2 or any later. >> * This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify >> * it under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by >> * the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or >> * (at your option) any later version. > > I guess the license is GPLV2 then, but I'm not sure, can someone > confirm this? The =E2=80=9Cor any later version=E2=80=9D wording is present in source fil= e headers, so it=E2=80=99s definitely =E2=80=98gpl2+=E2=80=99, not =E2=80=98gpl2=E2=80=99. I fixed this one and a couple of others in 7bd000d104f79f2b1c51c48c9d01f247189f9935. Thanks for the heads-up! Ludo=E2=80=99. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Jan Subject: Re: Proposal for Outreachy (May-August 2020) Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2020 02:15:57 +0100 Message-ID: <20200112021557.2de7cd30@kompiuter> References: <229482977533dfdcef5a2d60bbc94aee@disroot.org> <20200109205409.7d69453e@kompiuter> <87tv51sgtw.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:56828) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1iqRrS-0003Qy-3L for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 11 Jan 2020 20:16:15 -0500 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iqRrQ-0005BO-SV for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 11 Jan 2020 20:16:13 -0500 Received: from smtpo.poczta.interia.pl ([217.74.65.152]:60548) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iqRrQ-00050d-9o for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 11 Jan 2020 20:16:12 -0500 In-Reply-To: <87tv51sgtw.fsf@gnu.org> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Ludovic =?UTF-8?B?Q291cnTDqHM=?= Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org On Sun, 12 Jan 2020 00:39:55 +0100 Ludovic Court=C3=A8s wrote: > Hi, >=20 >=20 > The =E2=80=9Cor any later version=E2=80=9D wording is present in source f= ile headers, > so it=E2=80=99s definitely =E2=80=98gpl2+=E2=80=99, not =E2=80=98gpl2=E2= =80=99. Right, that's what I was supposed to say, but my brain removed the "+". > I fixed this one and a couple of others in > 7bd000d104f79f2b1c51c48c9d01f247189f9935. >=20 > Thanks for the heads-up! No problem. > Ludo=E2=80=99. Jan Wielkiewicz