From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Jean Louis Subject: Re: Joint statement on the GNU Project Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2019 06:09:48 +0200 Message-ID: <20191010040948.GW20430@protected.rcdrun.com> References: <87ftk4hbhu.fsf@gnu.org> <87wodfi44x.fsf@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33207) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1iIPm6-0002AG-46 for guix-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Oct 2019 00:10:03 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1iIPm4-00083r-GJ for guix-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Oct 2019 00:10:02 -0400 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <87wodfi44x.fsf@gmail.com> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Dimakakos Dimos Cc: Guix-devel , help-guix@gnu.org * Dimakakos Dimos [2019-10-08 12:38]: > On the subject, I think that the discussion of rms's position in GNU is > valid but that at the same time such an announcment should be made afte= r > a careful consideration and research. There was no public discussion. I am not against their opinion, and any discussion, I don't mind for hackers, guix, script kiddies, or wannabes to discuss anything, I don't mind for millions of rumor mongers in this world. What I do mind is that they are using funds of the FSF to defame and harass RMS. The one who gave them GUIX.GNU.ORG website and domain, web space, and one who has created GNU Project. > Do we have evidence that rms has caused harm to GNU's projects? There is no evidence. He is entitled to his opinion. For any project in the world, Mother Theresa even, there will be thoughtless people who are complaining for something. You can pour cash onto people, you will find people complaining. Always. It is social phenomena. > Even in the aspect of diversity and community building, do we have > evidence that rms is block or is it that we just play along with a > media campaign, that was in a fact a full on personality attack on > rms, by going as far as misquoting him. Facts (even if you know them): https://geoff.greer.fm/2019/09/30/in-defense-of-richard-stallman/ https://sterling-archermedes.github.io/ > I would like to hear you expand on ways that the empowerment of all > computer users was undermined by rms. I write all these in good > faith. On one hand I can accept that if there is concrete evidence, > on the other hand I see in the web media, people, associated with > companies that would like the software freedom fronts to collapse, > bash and drive out a person that offered his life to create and > support the movement. I have tried asking Ludovick Court=C3=A8s to tell me facts. I was genuine= ly interested, he has no facts. He is basing that opinion on rumour, there is no fact that RMS ever hurt "core values of GNU project over years" that is nonsense. Everybody is entitled to opinion and so is RMS. When that Media article came out, instead to show some loyalty and research the statements, which one could easily find not to be true, they started bashing on RMS. > In my opinion the timing is a bit off. By trying to solve whatever issu= e > the community has with rms at this particular point, Let us not generalize, "community" is generalization. Ludovick Court=C3=A8= s did not allow comments on his page, but there are comments on that on various other pages, there are hundreds contrary comments already, and just 2-3 people are joining their "statement" in the sense. Obviously that is "small group within larger group of GNU maintainers". It is not community that has a problem. It is them, right now 24, and I would like to see their integrity to fork the GNU project elsewhere and call it their own name, as GNU is a trademark. > is like validating the misinformation that has spread this last > month about his name. It's like the whole character assasination > that happens on web is valid so we need to cancel rms. I think this > is totally unfair. At the same time it's also important to move our > community forward in ways that include every person and also enable > people of all kinds of background to take part in GNU and this way > realize the software freedom ideals. It is more than unfair, it also shows that RMS has not enacted enough enforcing of policies. He is probably waiting for people to speak out, because he is waaaay to kind for this mob. > 2. How does rms with his afformentioned role undermine diversity > and inclusivity of people working in GNU projects? I hope to see the facts, but now I know they have none. Jean I am asking those people who are pretending to represent all of the GNU project and who are defaming and slandering RMS[1] to step down and resign, do your software hacking somewhere else, you do not deserve funding that RMS is giving you. Ludovic Court=C3=A8s, Ricardo Wurmus, Matt Lee, Andreas Enge, Samuel Thibault, Carlos O'Donell, Andy Wingo, Jordi Guti=C3=A9rrez Hermoso, Mark Wielaard, Ian Lance Taylor, Werner Koch, Daiki Ueno, Christopher Lemmer Webber, Jan Nieuwenhuizen, John Wiegley, Tom Tromey, Jeff Law, Han-Wen Nienhuys, Joshua Gay, Ian Jackson, Tobias Geerinckx-Rice, Andrej Shadura, Zack Weinberg, John W. Eaton, RESIGN and step down from GNU projects, disassociate yourself, find another house for your excessive and uncrontollable fear of the free speech. Facts: https://geoff.greer.fm/2019/09/30/in-defense-of-richard-stallman/ https://sterling-archermedes.github.io/