From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: ng0 Subject: Re: let's talk about SLIM Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2017 09:18:41 +0000 Message-ID: <20170830091841.rbjz4a4gdobinote@abyayala> References: <20170826213253.qxyveyztlhao22bu@abyayala> <87pobgkc39.fsf@netris.org> <87inh577xs.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="pj3jcngwjznj4btl" Return-path: Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:48724) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dmz9D-0006NY-Fz for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Aug 2017 05:18:56 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dmz9C-0007vw-5L for guix-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Aug 2017 05:18:55 -0400 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <87inh577xs.fsf@gnu.org> List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sender: "Guix-devel" To: Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org --pj3jcngwjznj4btl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ludovic Court=C3=A8s transcribed 2.2K bytes: > Hi, >=20 > Mark H Weaver skribis: >=20 > > ng0 writes: > > > >> It seems to me as if SLIM can be dropped once we > >> have something else in place. Would you agree? I no longer agree with my own proposed action. But the switch of the default choice is important. > > It would be good to keep a display manager service that is lightweight > > in terms of both resource usage, runtime-dependency closure, and > > build-dependency closure. I'm not attached to SLiM, but I would not > > consider the existence of a GDM service to be sufficient grounds for > > removal of SLiM. > > > > Apart from the needs of those on older hardware, or those who wish to > > build everything locally from source code, I'm not sure if we've ever > > successfully built GDM on a non-Intel system. GDM depends on mozjs-17, > > which I've never managed to build on mips64el-linux, and it fails on > > armhf-linux too. Fixing mozjs on mips64el-linux is probably not > > trivial, and yet I'm happily using SLiM on my Yeeloong, which is still > > the only non-Intel GuixSD system as far as I know. >=20 > I agree we should not remove SLiM. I think the question is more about > the default we want to have. >=20 > For people using %desktop-services with GNOME and all that, it probably > makes sense to default to GDM. >=20 > For the lightweight-desktop example, it may makes sense to stick to a > lightweight login tool. >=20 > One grief I have against SLiM is that it lacks i18n support. If lightdm > fixes that, I would recommend it instead of SLiM in the > lightweight-desktop example. I haven=E2=80=99t investigated though. >=20 > Thoughts? My main concern indeed is the way keyboard layouts are handled in SLIM (see https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D26234). As a default this is not good. However it is easy to switch the default selection of a login tool, but the default choice should be one that makes it easy to select one or multiple keyboard layouts from a list. The default is what most people will use for GuixSD. And if they can no longer type in the password the way they've set them up in the installer or on tty after boot because the default login manager they selected is written this way, they will be quick to disregard as a decision Guix made. The default choice represents "the Guix preference" (for the time it was ma= de). > > Personally, I'd be much happier with a working system that could be > > audited and not have the audit become stale before its completion. The > > amount of code churn in my systems is so great that it's infeasible for > > me to audit all of the changes coming down the pipe. I find that very > > uncomfortable. >=20 > On one hand I sympathize (I don=E2=80=99t use GNOME/KDE/Xfce and have lon= g tried > to avoid tools depending on the whole Freedesktop stack in my =E2=80=9Cba= se=E2=80=9D > system), but on the other hand, I think we have to realize that (1) no > single individual can audit more than a tiny fraction of their system, > and (2) when it comes to running a full desktop environment, we=E2=80=99r= e even > further away from that goal anyway, GDM or not. >=20 > Thanks, > Ludo=E2=80=99. --=20 ng0 GnuPG: A88C8ADD129828D7EAC02E52E22F9BBFEE348588 GnuPG: https://n0is.noblogs.org/my-keys https://www.infotropique.org https://krosos.org --pj3jcngwjznj4btl Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCgAdFiEEqIyK3RKYKNfqwC5S4i+bv+40hYgFAlmmgvEACgkQ4i+bv+40 hYjP2hAAoevW78k0MB3RrGPRiUB8zSBzcdCof2Y1UICzw7JF5++DJ2aRZO2iFpsK hd5SN7c6cKUMGZhT2SZGwmR7blQKllP6SrCO60PPaE513JAiGdI4gBKq00eNOeu5 UfJQ5GFQsTtdbwuDXb9L/2lUQcKOAjJnztRNL9LNmvfHX6HHqkyrowRJK+zTcwfi NKRJ1ZyMETRaK2D+v4J6A9GquAYhh/1yAJFYozMQdLMcQ5j5bWInrZxVAjAhVZML jBE00s656CRpKBMHDVGQq5zJOlVXPYPOVOBjww8jUXuAktFLdtpX8Rv6OUlvAsO6 BBhxS4eW+tf0hw3cStn7AYqdxsBlLxa/c+3Bj8QcQWTa/mz2PZuySIeSiAuTGgZS /+vqs1KjzjB2h6rCarSNjZECEzc+50NkiMe+qkI495KZ3OD5UqCHfhA4mWuBZKKH 0cTNXw0xYncHfE/Xpiklzn7cYfl7D7+dpM6cW27zdjng3So5DpRYHJq8XpW/8nkM 8b01Sd3bjEJRpNxEwx86x23AIP1s4bNuRQKGIDJoayScLyWnTeC/A18e8q8cEhiM NkVOljuJzRXrB9u85mqZ6j44Bo8ijQxbrhnGB7iDmp7ovqcybrmT6VkTLxyBisuK VaF3HPwrK55GvzPK80lH4JRa6amum47GOwrNR1xpPL6rRNljfIE= =LJR2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --pj3jcngwjznj4btl--