From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Sebastian Tennant Newsgroups: gmane.lisp.guile.user Subject: Re: Dynamic variable binding Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 15:56:06 +0000 Message-ID: References: <8wro202o.fsf@vps203.linuxvps.org> <200811130051.mAD0pReg006490@fcs13.keithdiane.us> <200812200017.mBK0HprS003845@fcs13.keithdiane.us> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1230393357 11636 80.91.229.12 (27 Dec 2008 15:55:57 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 15:55:57 +0000 (UTC) To: guile-user@gnu.org Original-X-From: guile-user-bounces+guile-user=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Dec 27 16:57:05 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: guile-user@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1LGbXE-0004p8-Lb for guile-user@m.gmane.org; Sat, 27 Dec 2008 16:57:04 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55391 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LGbW1-0004OI-4b for guile-user@m.gmane.org; Sat, 27 Dec 2008 10:55:49 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LGbVw-0004Nu-HT for guile-user@gnu.org; Sat, 27 Dec 2008 10:55:44 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LGbVw-0004Ng-4d for guile-user@gnu.org; Sat, 27 Dec 2008 10:55:44 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=59724 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LGbVv-0004Nb-UV for guile-user@gnu.org; Sat, 27 Dec 2008 10:55:43 -0500 Original-Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2]:41250 helo=ciao.gmane.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1LGbVv-0003a8-Fx for guile-user@gnu.org; Sat, 27 Dec 2008 10:55:43 -0500 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1LGbVo-0000c5-RT for guile-user@gnu.org; Sat, 27 Dec 2008 15:55:36 +0000 Original-Received: from vps203.linuxvps.org ([91.186.7.203]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sat, 27 Dec 2008 15:55:36 +0000 Original-Received: from sebyte by vps203.linuxvps.org with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sat, 27 Dec 2008 15:55:36 +0000 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 64 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: vps203.linuxvps.org User-Agent: Gnus/5.110011 (No Gnus v0.11) Emacs/22.2 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:5elSvZ8DvEJClQrj9G15bLl4rbk= X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: guile-user@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General Guile related discussions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: guile-user-bounces+guile-user=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: guile-user-bounces+guile-user=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.lisp.guile.user:7036 Archived-At: Quoth Keith Wright : >> From: Sebastian Tennant >>> Quoth Keith Wright : >>> I don't know what happens (in Guile), but I can tell >>> you what _should_ happen. (In my humble opinion as >>> a demi-god of semantics.) >> I'm trying to wrap my head around symbols, variables >> and names of variables. They seem to me to be three >> different things. > NB: I hate emoticons. The lack of a smiley face does > not imply seriousness. This sort of thing has been > puzzling a lot of people for a long time. In particular, > I published a paper about it some 25 years ago, but have > since decided that I don't know enough to be publishing. > That's why it's fun to rave on the mailing list. So... you're not a demi-god of semantics. Damn. I told all my friends that you were. > I almost understand something about symbols and variables, but the > _name_ of a variable is not a technical term. I don't name variables, > I just call them "this variable" or "that variable", or sometimes > describe them as the "local variable |foo|". >>> But you are asking the wrong question. Ask not what happens when a >>> symbol is defined, ask what you can do to make the macro define an >>> unquoted variable. >> Answer: Pass it an unquoted variable. >> >> Is that the answer you expected? > I am not sure I expected it, but it makes me feel good to know that it > works. Pleased to be of service. >> My semantic point is that the first argument to definer (above) is >> not a symbol and it's not a variable (an unbound variable error would >> be thrown if it was), so in the context of the first agument to >> define there is a third data type; 'variable name'. > > I am quite sure that it _is_ a variable, because the Scheme report, in > the section on Variable Definitions, says: > > (define ) > ...define binds to a new location... > > you yourself say "pass it an unquoted variable". I thought about this obvious contradiction but decided the pith outweighed the loss. > "The name of the song is called 'Haddocks' eyes'." "Oh, that's the > name of the song, is it?" Alice said. "No, you don't understand," > the Knight said, looking a little vexed. "That's what the name is > _called_." I wonder what song it was to which Haddock's Eyes referred. Sebastian