From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Thien-Thi Nguyen Newsgroups: gmane.lisp.guile.user Subject: Re: [d.love@dl.ac.uk: dynamic loading of native code modules] Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 13:54:48 -0700 Sender: guile-user-admin@gnu.org Message-ID: References: <878z7rqfrg.fsf@raven.i.defaultvalue.org> <87znztllbx.fsf@raven.i.defaultvalue.org> <1021392674.802.71.camel@flophouse> Reply-To: ttn@glug.org NNTP-Posting-Host: localhost.gmane.org X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1021410039 10810 127.0.0.1 (14 May 2002 21:00:39 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 21:00:39 +0000 (UTC) Cc: guile-devel@gnu.org, guile-user@gnu.org Return-path: Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([199.232.76.164]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1 (Debian)) id 177jPT-0002oF-00 for ; Tue, 14 May 2002 23:00:39 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 3.34 #1 (Debian)) id 177jOw-0002vI-00; Tue, 14 May 2002 17:00:06 -0400 Original-Received: from ca-crlsbd-u5-c4a-a-172.crlsca.adelphia.net ([24.48.214.172] helo=giblet) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 3.34 #1 (Debian)) id 177jNg-0002ld-00; Tue, 14 May 2002 16:58:48 -0400 Original-Received: from ttn by giblet with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 177jJo-0000u1-00; Tue, 14 May 2002 13:54:48 -0700 Original-To: grib@linuxdevel.com In-Reply-To: <1021392674.802.71.camel@flophouse> (message from Bill Gribble on 14 May 2002 11:11:12 -0500) Errors-To: guile-user-admin@gnu.org X-BeenThere: guile-user@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.9 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: General Guile related discussions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.lisp.guile.user:416 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.lisp.guile.user:416 From: Bill Gribble Date: 14 May 2002 11:11:12 -0500 On Tue, 2002-05-14 at 05:57, Thien-Thi Nguyen wrote: > it looks like a plan to just implement something and throw it against > the wall to see if it sticks. in particular, having the interface > number encoded in the name doesn't sound like fun for anyone. For someone who spends so much time hopping up and down about process and development culture, you sure don't hesitate to start throwing around derogatory and inflammatory language. Put a cork in it, please! Language like this makes you part of the problem, not part of the solution. The whole idea of encoding interface numbers in the name was explicitly and exclusively a temporary hack. It certainly wasn't proposed by _anybody_ as a final solution. the two areas you mention are independent; i don't see the connection. good process demands open exchange of different ideas, including the evaluation of "is this idea sound or will there be problems?" by people besides one's nanny. i don't see how hacks that touch /usr/local/lib and require third party cooperation (by some who are extremely vociferous in their disgust of bad design, trust me) can be called "temporary". but let's say that this does go into code and (less discerning) people buy into it. what exactly is the final form of the "guile plugin"? will it be compatible w/ this scheme? if not, what help will you provide to keep me from cursing your name and switching to SCM+SLIB+Hobbit? etc. if you want to dissuade discerning people from characterizing your work as "throwing it against a wall to see if it sticks", you have to answer these kinds of questions (by asking them of yourself, or finding some unpleasant person to ask them for you ;-). which means you have to know how your current scheme relates to its final form. which means you have to design for the long term. this is not easy to do, granted. the general principle applicable here is (once again) encapsulation. some of these annoying questions can be rendered moot (you could be free to encode favorite color and zodiac sign in the name, why not?) if the shared objects need not live in a public dir. other questions (like how you help ford incompatibilites) are always in play. thi _______________________________________________ Guile-user mailing list Guile-user@gnu.org http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/guile-user