From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Damien Mattei Newsgroups: gmane.lisp.guile.user Subject: Re: Guile Steel: a proposal for a systems lisp Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2022 16:47:04 +0200 Message-ID: References: <87v8s6xpnq.fsf@dustycloud.org> <87zgggjk8n.fsf@dustycloud.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="39380"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Guile User To: Christine Lemmer-Webber Original-X-From: guile-user-bounces+guile-user=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Aug 07 16:47:45 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: guile-user@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oKhZB-000A3M-17 for guile-user@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 16:47:45 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:59984 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oKhZA-0006rC-5Z for guile-user@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 10:47:44 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:35812) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oKhYm-0006nB-Kz for guile-user@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 10:47:20 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-lf1-x135.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::135]:45974) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oKhYk-0003pH-LF for guile-user@gnu.org; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 10:47:20 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-lf1-x135.google.com with SMTP id a9so9394344lfm.12 for ; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 07:47:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc; bh=RHID0D99ma+XLwfRsf9LOV0BDb0skBptds6IGcW7x/w=; b=L7Gw6ImhLj6CQuM3wlVJhmQ7LIB4c5vVbJPFiYD1Sw6eo4OkDyrEG00KuRBiwQlmLd p4/BU5SS04lln51wv5dU2ukSmYlpDbuL2BebAvROB0SrmfDZIAUW5NpAoGH0mIZ6GgR9 zdLVhLqx7HxMRSCvJClvR2wD2lmeMctuNZ0C4vs8BmYcGvlDk6dzp0EfBBC3ekUiJvT5 +jD/g2hu0qGB+BI6o+dd1s01rd+vTpD9cLTDkl3/qk+pAipAeMzKXtMhu+5fWkYl9aiV 5qaYh/bkVc0Z3nfwwqgSnDU0LhDPvb2qsfhHXnPbc3DfcSD8+zGpgz5S4I+y7Wvl5aNY MDGg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc; bh=RHID0D99ma+XLwfRsf9LOV0BDb0skBptds6IGcW7x/w=; b=lFldmZ9sKCLGf33O7YlEDudCO89/bWYj9LhgPzMgAdCuTNxeHtPfVoOUMdTJLHEqIR 7VU5UYfFHpnAl0t3cLOuMjya/3G2vUKdLUYQi2kfgH6nCaWR5KquB3Njb/kg3lunAAaj GupNFJfEdjERyUZLETPz7KQGcjuD61rh/5qCn+swBH9b5+kfTw7+vWScRI+7w+iwXTRx umdyBMZo7DbA9RjqD46EbWkkXVo9Shl2MCsu5Is87TTkcuJHC+Tbd2nT4bLsZ84JMozf EUyrhMS6bhfldb8rHmLcuSDWCXWtqZ1Y3DH0xiqdMD2zdPtoYUNUERgrIezTUOYhnBIx OA9Q== X-Gm-Message-State: ACgBeo1vaFSupLrOIomStnR8JYfHnf+/G9n++/1q/A/gI7OtErtJHkEM /NbivrRD0yMhatn0y62SAJMP8ASOHAlQK8H3rRQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AA6agR41fFNpfQLJGlaqbjTk5WuxTJuMRSZdK9rpgsAsh0dZJcrUF9Zj+Z9z8UNUDv/k91L2FS0AWP9/La9y8fW7m+Q= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6512:c0d:b0:48a:f796:cbd7 with SMTP id z13-20020a0565120c0d00b0048af796cbd7mr4851551lfu.654.1659883636203; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 07:47:16 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87zgggjk8n.fsf@dustycloud.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::135; envelope-from=damien.mattei@gmail.com; helo=mail-lf1-x135.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: guile-user@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: General Guile related discussions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guile-user-bounces+guile-user=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "guile-user" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.lisp.guile.user:18499 Archived-At: On Sun, Aug 7, 2022 at 2:44 PM Christine Lemmer-Webber < cwebber@dustycloud.org> wrote: > Bigloo is cool. I think it falls under the same category of Chicken, > which I address towards the end of: > > https://dustycloud.org/blog/guile-steel-smelting-pot/ > > "Chicken Scheme compiles to C but doesn't strike me as qualifying for > this post's vague definition because it still has the usual > memory/dynamic typing overheads of Scheme. But go ahead and read > literally everything on more-magic.net anyway because that stuff is > great." > > Same feels like it could be said of Bigloo, but if I'm wrong, lmk :) > perhaps i'm wrong, but Chicken seems to have strict types as options: http://wiki.call-cc.org/man/5/Types about Bigloo the best answer would be to ask to author himself but i used Bigloo a little to produce JVM class files only, not C obj files , and it can be declared some statically typed variable i think in both C and Java targets: see: https://www-sop.inria.fr/mimosa/fp/Bigloo/manual.html#G82 and mostly: https://www-sop.inria.fr/mimosa/fp/Bigloo/manual-chapter25.html Regards, Damien > > > Damien Mattei writes: > > > perhaps Bigloo a Scheme that targets C and has many other features can > help: > > https://www-sop.inria.fr/mimosa/fp/Bigloo/ > > Damien > > > > On Sat, Jul 9, 2022 at 5:38 PM Christine Lemmer-Webber < > cwebber@dustycloud.org> wrote: > > > > A little blogpost this morning, not actual software, but software > > desiderata: > > https://dustycloud.org/blog/guile-steel-proposal/ > > > > I'd love to see something like the above happen. I'd love to help make > > it happen. So this is more of a call to arms than anything else. > > > > Can we have a "systems lisp"? Can we do better than Rust? Let's put > > some interesting things on that compiler tower of ours! > >