From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Chris Hall Newsgroups: gmane.lisp.guile.user Subject: ASDF for guile (Was Re: guile-lib things) Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2004 15:22:30 -1000 Sender: guile-user-bounces+guile-user=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <87acyp7q21.fsf@naia.homelinux.net> References: <1088100238.1855.207.camel@localhost> NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0373243913==" X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1088299391 29893 80.91.224.253 (27 Jun 2004 01:23:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2004 01:23:11 +0000 (UTC) Original-X-From: guile-user-bounces+guile-user=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Jun 27 03:23:04 2004 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1BeONr-000057-00 for ; Sun, 27 Jun 2004 03:23:04 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1BeOPO-0001zb-TC for guile-user@m.gmane.org; Sat, 26 Jun 2004 21:24:38 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.33) id 1BeOPM-0001zW-1g for guile-user@gnu.org; Sat, 26 Jun 2004 21:24:36 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.33) id 1BeOPI-0001zJ-CW for guile-user@gnu.org; Sat, 26 Jun 2004 21:24:35 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1BeOPI-0001zG-Az for guile-user@gnu.org; Sat, 26 Jun 2004 21:24:32 -0400 Original-Received: from [80.91.224.249] (helo=main.gmane.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1BeONe-0001JU-Qw for guile-user@gnu.org; Sat, 26 Jun 2004 21:22:51 -0400 Original-Received: from list by main.gmane.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1BeONd-0001AH-00 for ; Sun, 27 Jun 2004 03:22:49 +0200 Original-Received: from hnllhi1-ar2-4-64-145-131.hnllhi1.dsl-verizon.net ([4.64.145.131]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sun, 27 Jun 2004 03:22:48 +0200 Original-Received: from hall.cj by hnllhi1-ar2-4-64-145-131.hnllhi1.dsl-verizon.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sun, 27 Jun 2004 03:22:48 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-To: guile-user@gnu.org Original-Lines: 73 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: hnllhi1-ar2-4-64-145-131.hnllhi1.dsl-verizon.net X-GPG-Fingerprint: 32EA 90A5 8C01 5755 3847 2AFE AD9C B8E7 93E2 83A4 X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux User-Agent: Gnus/5.1006 (Gnus v5.10.6) Emacs/21.2 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:cNIQq//IWQMs6SSyfEVGjjR2J0w= X-BeenThere: guile-user@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.4 Precedence: list List-Id: General Guile related discussions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guile-user-bounces+guile-user=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.lisp.guile.user:3286 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.lisp.guile.user:3286 --===============0373243913== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature" --=-=-= Andy Wingo writes: > I wanted to lay these conflicts out on the table, so that the choices we > make as distributors/packagers/coders are more coherent (that word > again!), and so that we can discuss them. Perhaps they are indicative of > the fundamental problem of guile-lib: it's centralized. Compared to > something like asdf or CPAN, we're doing too much work. But then unlike > CL or Perl, Scheme doesn't have a standard module system. Thoughts on Sorry - I'm a little confused by the terminology here. By "standard module system" do you mean a standard distribution/build/install system? Isn't that what asdf/CPAN do? IIUC, neither asdf nor CPAN are part of the language, or official in anyway - they are simply "standard" by way of popularity and common usage? > how to decentralize, or the merits of decentralization, are certainly > welcome. I'd vote for de-centralized, even though each has its pluses and minuses. A de-centralized system would seem to provide more freedom for the individual developers/packagers/maintainers, and would likely reduce the time needed to get updates distributed. This, hopefully, would allowing for faster development, feedback, etc. On a related note: how feasible would an 'asdf for guile' be? Is there a need for such a thing? It seems to me that guile is *more* appropriate than lisp for this sort of task, since guile is already so integrated to its host OS, and doesn't have to worry nearly as much - if at all - about other guile 'flavors' - lisp has so many different semi-compatible 'flavors' it is a real issue and constant topic of discussion on c.l.lisp. I've only recently begun using guile, though I have installed several 'add-ons' already. I have also used asdf to install lisp software, as well as asdf's pre-cursor/inspiration 'mk-system'. (Or was it 'defsystem'?) Some asdf packages compile C modules they provide for FFI (foreign function interface) purposes - this certainly seems similar to guile's capability as an extension language. It does seem that the amazing 'make' facility in use by so many free (as in speech) packages is overkill for a lot of purposes, never mind the challenges of doing a good make procedure. For guile-only (no C) packages especially a version of asdf for guile would seem golden. Hmmm. +Chris -- Everywhere is walking distance if you have the time. -- Steven Wright (1955 - ) --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQBA3iFkrZy455Pig6QRAo25AJ9k6aChwLyTzjHPVknpfVPJW7QeMwCfU6kI uf7LMjMyR934j6Nt8nPqLgU= =lNxH -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- --===============0373243913== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Guile-user mailing list Guile-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/guile-user --===============0373243913==--