ANN: SDOM project development release 0.4

ANN: SDOM project development release 0.4

[Julian Graham]

Hi Schemers,

I'm pleased to announce that the SDOM project has released version
0.4, our third development release.  This version features hundreds of
tests added to the core test suite, bringing the package into much
greater conformance with the W3C's specification.  The documentation
has been greatly improved, and many bugs have been fixed since the
0.1.2 release; the NEWS file in the distribution contains specific
details.

SDOM is an attempt to provide a complete implementation of the W3C
Document Object Model Level 3 specification, including event handling,
in Scheme, as an extension of Oleg Kiselyov's SXML system.

At the moment, SDOM is been developed in (and has only been tested on)
GNU Guile, but could certainly be ported to any interpreter platform
on which SXML runs.  For more information, swing by
http://www.nongnu.org/sdom or check out our project page on Savannah,
at
http://savannah.nongnu.org/projects/sdom -- you can pick up the
release from the downloads section.


Cheers,
Julian


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Re: ANN: SDOM project development release 0.4

[Neil Jerram]

Julian Graham <joolean-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> writes:

> Hi Schemers,
>
> I'm pleased to announce that the SDOM project has released version
> 0.4, our third development release.  [...] SDOM is an attempt to
> provide a complete implementation of the W3C Document Object Model
> Level 3 specification, including event handling, in Scheme, as an
> extension of Oleg Kiselyov's SXML system.

Hi Julian,

Forgive my ignorance, but can you indicate how/where I might use SDOM,
other than within a web browser?  I looked at your manual, but it was
a case of all trees and no wood.

(And within a web browser, it seems to me that the browser would have
to support Scheme, which I don't believe any of the common ones do
right now.)

Regards,
        Neil




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Re: ANN: SDOM project development release 0.4

[Julian Graham]

Hi Neil,
  Well, maybe I don't understand the question, but I'd say you could
use SDOM pretty much anywhere you'd use, say, JDOM, but wanted to use
Scheme instead of Java.  Granted, the most popular application of the
DOM is in web browsers alongside (X)HTML, but I find it's quite handy
for doing high-level manipulation of XML documents in general.  I know
some people have strong feelings about the isomorphism between XML and
S-expressions that SXML exploits and that SDOM kind of runs counter to
that, but it also provides a few features that SSAX doesn't -- and
that I needed for the projects I'm working on -- such as the event
handling stuff and a stronger type system for XML nodes.
  As regards the manual, point taken -- I'm kind of assuming a high
level of familiarity with W3C specifications and the docs could
probably use some more examples / discussion of applications.


Regards,
Julian

On 12/28/05, Neil Jerram <neil-0S17iFHR5lf2/9iHc7UuXF6hYfS7NtTn@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> Julian Graham <joolean-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> writes:
>
> > Hi Schemers,
> >
> > I'm pleased to announce that the SDOM project has released version
> > 0.4, our third development release.  [...] SDOM is an attempt to
> > provide a complete implementation of the W3C Document Object Model
> > Level 3 specification, including event handling, in Scheme, as an
> > extension of Oleg Kiselyov's SXML system.
>
> Hi Julian,
>
> Forgive my ignorance, but can you indicate how/where I might use SDOM,
> other than within a web browser?  I looked at your manual, but it was
> a case of all trees and no wood.
>
> (And within a web browser, it seems to me that the browser would have
> to support Scheme, which I don't believe any of the common ones do
> right now.)
>
> Regards,
>         Neil
>
>
>


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Re: ANN: SDOM project development release 0.4

[klaus schilling]

Why is SDOM not part of the guile-lib,
whereas SSAX is?

Klaus Schilling


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Re: ANN: SDOM project development release 0.4

[Julian Graham]

Well, I would imagine because Andy Wingo (or whoever it is that's
maintaining guile-lib these days) doesn't know about it / doesn't
think it's a mature enough piece of code -- which it probably isn't.


On 12/29/05, klaus schilling <schilling.klaus@web.de> wrote:
> Why is SDOM not part of the guile-lib,
> whereas SSAX is?
>
> Klaus Schilling
>


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Re: ANN: SDOM project development release 0.4

[Neil Jerram]

Julian Graham <joolean-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> writes:

> Hi Neil,
>   Well, maybe I don't understand the question, but I'd say you could
> use SDOM pretty much anywhere you'd use, say, JDOM,

I'm afraid that doesn't help me much ... unless there are JDOM
applications that I could refer to as examples?

> but wanted to use
> Scheme instead of Java.  Granted, the most popular application of the
> DOM is in web browsers alongside (X)HTML, but I find it's quite handy
> for doing high-level manipulation of XML documents in general.

But isn't everything event-driven?  As in, execute so-and-so script on
so-and-so objects when I click on this link?  And in that case, don't
you need something that amounts to a web browser (or at least, an
HTML/XML page renderer) to exercise the DOM?

>  I know
> some people have strong feelings about the isomorphism between XML and
> S-expressions that SXML exploits and that SDOM kind of runs counter to
> that, but it also provides a few features that SSAX doesn't -- and
> that I needed for the projects I'm working on -- such as the event
> handling stuff and a stronger type system for XML nodes.

That's rather over my head, so definitely not a concern of mine :-)

Regards,
        Neil



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Re: ANN: SDOM project development release 0.4

[Julian Graham]

On 12/31/05, Neil Jerram <neil-0S17iFHR5lf2/9iHc7UuXF6hYfS7NtTn@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> I'm afraid that doesn't help me much ... unless there are JDOM
> applications that I could refer to as examples?

I think this is turning into a defense of the DOM spec itself, which I
think would answer most of your questions.  When it comes to JDOM, I'd
say that you'd use it any place you wanted to easily manipulate an XML
document in Java as a tree of nodes instead of as a stream of XML
tokens -- obviously, web applications are a major market for this, but
a trivial non-web application might be... parsing and querying an XML
configuration file.

> But isn't everything event-driven?  As in, execute so-and-so script on
> so-and-so objects when I click on this link?  And in that case, don't
> you need something that amounts to a web browser (or at least, an
> HTML/XML page renderer) to exercise the DOM?

Yes, but the DOM spec allows you to embed event handlers in the
document tree that respond in a cascading fashion to changes in the
document that may or may not be triggered by the user of the embedding
application -- for example, you might have an event handler that sorts
the nodes in a tree by attribute value whenever it's notified by the
DOM that a new node has been added to the document.  You could
certainly implement this at the level of the embedding application,
but I think it's quite efficient to have the DOM handle such flows of
events for you.


Regards,
Julian


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Re: ANN: SDOM project development release 0.4

[Neil Jerram]

Julian Graham <joolean@gmail.com> writes:

> On 12/31/05, Neil Jerram <neil@ossau.uklinux.net> wrote:
>> I'm afraid that doesn't help me much ... unless there are JDOM
>> applications that I could refer to as examples?
>
> I think this is turning into a defense of the DOM spec itself, which I
> think would answer most of your questions.

Yes, fair enough, I need to read the spec then.

> Yes, but the DOM spec allows you to embed event handlers in the
> document tree that respond in a cascading fashion to changes in the
> document that may or may not be triggered by the user of the embedding
> application -- for example, you might have an event handler that sorts
> the nodes in a tree by attribute value whenever it's notified by the
> DOM that a new node has been added to the document.

Interesting.  Thanks for answering my questions thus far.

Regards,
        Neil



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