From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Mark H Weaver Newsgroups: gmane.lisp.guile.devel Subject: Re: About Guile crypto support Date: Sat, 09 Feb 2013 12:50:51 -0500 Message-ID: <87zjzd4br8.fsf@tines.lan> References: <1359896146.2754.19.camel@Renee-desktop.suse> <871ucvof60.fsf@gnu.org> <1360032192.2754.61.camel@Renee-desktop.suse> <87mwvisqwj.fsf@gnu.org> <878v6yojxg.fsf@gnu.org> <87sj55bjxz.fsf@gnu.org> <87mwvdwhcs.fsf@pobox.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1360432664 21106 80.91.229.3 (9 Feb 2013 17:57:44 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 9 Feb 2013 17:57:44 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Ludovic =?utf-8?Q?Court=C3=A8s?= , guile-devel@gnu.org To: Andy Wingo Original-X-From: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Feb 09 18:58:05 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: guile-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1U4Ege-0004eK-9Q for guile-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 09 Feb 2013 18:58:04 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38280 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1U4EgL-0008OO-8J for guile-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 09 Feb 2013 12:57:45 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:52691) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1U4EZz-0007ia-BN for guile-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 Feb 2013 12:51:12 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1U4EZx-000145-Ad for guile-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 Feb 2013 12:51:11 -0500 Original-Received: from world.peace.net ([96.39.62.75]:41164) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1U4EZx-000141-6M; Sat, 09 Feb 2013 12:51:09 -0500 Original-Received: from 209-6-91-212.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com ([209.6.91.212] helo=tines.lan) by world.peace.net with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1U4EZp-0003ga-OJ; Sat, 09 Feb 2013 12:51:01 -0500 In-Reply-To: <87mwvdwhcs.fsf@pobox.com> (Andy Wingo's message of "Sat, 09 Feb 2013 18:02:27 +0100") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.2 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 96.39.62.75 X-BeenThere: guile-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Developers list for Guile, the GNU extensibility library" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.lisp.guile.devel:15717 Archived-At: Hi Andy, Andy Wingo writes: > On Sat 09 Feb 2013 16:12, ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic Court=C3=A8s) writes: > >> An issue with the FFI is distros where .la and .so files are only >> available in the -dev package, because then =E2=80=98dynamic-link=E2=80= =99 won=E2=80=99t work >> unless that -dev package is installed (as recently discussed on >> guile-user.) > > I have the feeling that we should implement our own dynamic-link > function without libltdl. It would eliminate a dependency and allow us > to use other search path rules, like ones that could deal with this > case. I think the situation would actually be better on other > architectures because we wouldn't have to deal with bugs like this one: > > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.lisp.guile.bugs/5269 The problems we're having with libltdl are likely affecting many other projects. Wouldn't it be better to fix these problems in libltdl, to the benefit of all its users, than for each of its users to duplicate its functionality within their own projects? More generally, I'm concerned with the direction we are being pressured into by those who complain about the number of dependencies. We ought to look for better solutions than duplicating library functionality within Guile's own source code. Imagine if every program did that. That way lies madness. IMO, we ought to look for better solutions for those who complain about dependencies. One idea is to provide precompiled versions of Guile for the major platforms (i.e. MinGW, MacOS and possibly also GNU/Linux) with all dependencies included, for use by libguile-based projects that wish to provide precompiled bundles for their users. It might also make sense to provide something along the lines of jhbuild to make the build job easier for those who want more flexibility. What do you think? Mark