From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ricardo Wurmus Newsgroups: gmane.lisp.guile.devel Subject: Re: Name of the standard library Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2024 18:50:47 +0200 Message-ID: <87wmlewuxk.fsf@elephly.net> References: <20240629002027.13853-1-richard@freakingpenguin.com> <87h6co21qv.fsf@laura> <87r0bsxpoe.fsf@web.de> <4d9d9c2e-0830-4267-b8e5-1a50cb815508@msavoritias.me> <87a5ifyd0g.fsf@web.de> <20240719104617.pLmG2C00D4SnA1G01LmG1n@andre.telenet-ops.be> <87wmlgkyix.fsf@web.de> <15398dda-cb3e-4195-b2f8-263a59a73c68@lassi.io> <8734o4kte6.fsf@web.de> <26be9945-cd09-4268-825d-c35ba296a25f@msavoritias.me> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="35441"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: "Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide" , Lassi Kortela , Attila Lendvai , Maxime Devos , Greg Troxel , "guile-devel@gnu.org" To: MSavoritias Original-X-From: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Jul 21 18:51:53 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: guile-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1sVZmp-000902-V8 for guile-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 21 Jul 2024 18:51:52 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1sVZmW-0000HU-4z; Sun, 21 Jul 2024 12:51:32 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1sVZmU-0000Gg-I2 for guile-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 21 Jul 2024 12:51:30 -0400 Original-Received: from sender4-of-o51.zoho.com ([136.143.188.51]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1sVZmS-0008CJ-AJ for guile-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 21 Jul 2024 12:51:30 -0400 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1721580653; cv=none; d=zohomail.com; s=zohoarc; b=mR7Xs+VhR0B3vw5dYz/nzkC/gOzuowQXPGIGBgN/MlX0C0ktlXtgyPfX3zSDtlHTQDqLZBAnfUSgKDin6tI5Y7CdjzZSze5gXPnHy+rHKyBVuwHTrwF+761y/nh2ga4JcKGY63ClDEb5vQ1FGyxv21xXkU62EwAOqnUcoqpQihk= ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=zohomail.com; s=zohoarc; t=1721580653; h=Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Cc:Cc:Date:Date:From:From:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Message-ID:References:Subject:Subject:To:To:Message-Id:Reply-To; bh=02MveAkcZkvJ3Rhs2TasTs1JmOKBJQWtN82vIO7syFo=; b=Vmn+1ER+EZ+EGICb9gVFCs694wT6wHjmryAuPkTWPWcqFE/Npicsdz+hTBujVOlxB4umlfGlArGZnGqAwB+taE9s9e4WbbzlxzQZvj9ZEK5BGFEpl3fTaHQ1U+YnpBy3v5t0UzDC3c4brWDeT79DtsVYxvjUQVBWd5IRv34MwRc= ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.zohomail.com; dkim=pass header.i=elephly.net; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=rekado@elephly.net; dmarc=pass header.from= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; t=1721580653; s=zoho; d=elephly.net; i=rekado@elephly.net; h=From:From:To:To:Cc:Cc:Subject:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-Id:Reply-To; bh=02MveAkcZkvJ3Rhs2TasTs1JmOKBJQWtN82vIO7syFo=; b=PrRzcZT7/62SkjIYLIxmfz1dGo68EJVP1hUYaRXnL7XlHVvrTkCmOhuRGHjSR5ne 3y2D9KGfgVa5c9mZmd1mlSGwJdYa5NrtZ05ukoopBywpIdTS0+o4LPDWVpL2zvxBuwB vxPWYhpK0fxb2gqM+PbVD3BXEfQug/ZOxAcdMiCw= Original-Received: by mx.zohomail.com with SMTPS id 1721580652728499.1595953600372; Sun, 21 Jul 2024 09:50:52 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <26be9945-cd09-4268-825d-c35ba296a25f@msavoritias.me> (MSavoritias's message of "Sun, 21 Jul 2024 10:15:14 +0300") X-ZohoMailClient: External Received-SPF: pass client-ip=136.143.188.51; envelope-from=rekado@elephly.net; helo=sender4-of-o51.zoho.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guile-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Developers list for Guile, the GNU extensibility library" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.lisp.guile.devel:22625 Archived-At: MSavoritias writes: >> I actually liked that name =E2=80=94 and still like it. Keep in mind tha= t being >> professional quality doesn=E2=80=99t require being teflon-proof naming. = Python >> includes `import this` and `import antigravity`. Because exposing ones >> humanity isn=E2=80=99t a problem. > > Just a note here, I am that newbie :) > > And guile is much easier than whatever inside joke "ice-9" is. > > And no I don't need to "prove" myself by going through learning > whatever ice-9 is. Maybe I'm just pathologically uncurious, but I just "learned" it as an opaque name and moved on. Many years later I read "Cat's Cradle", which was very enjoyable, but did not do anything to teach me about "ice-9". (It pushed me into a short Vonnegut reading frenzy; would recommend.) There really is nothing to *learn* here. > We should make it easier to learn guile over time. I strongly disagree > forcing newbies to go through the same things we did just to make a > point. There are countless obstacles when learning Guile (whether you're coming from some other programming language or if Guile is your first). The name "ice-9" really isn't one of them. --=20 Ricardo