From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Andreas Rottmann Newsgroups: gmane.lisp.guile.devel Subject: Re: r6rs libraries, round three Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 02:33:25 +0100 Message-ID: <87my2kmxay.fsf@delenn.lan> References: <2bc5f8210909261310q7a32ff83x8ebceb44a78d55c5@mail.gmail.com> <2bc5f8210909302132w258d3f09tf1259bdfd6b1ca9e@mail.gmail.com> <2bc5f8210910241210t11ee37a9o60f3991eb35eab55@mail.gmail.com> <2bc5f8210910252053o31424493re2648f133bf7691f@mail.gmail.com> <2bc5f8210911011126j66abb05ck57e0610903932146@mail.gmail.com> <2bc5f8210911171255m5a731127idd6876d258584e25@mail.gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1258508045 12262 80.91.229.12 (18 Nov 2009 01:34:05 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 01:34:05 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Andy Wingo , guile-devel To: Julian Graham Original-X-From: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Nov 18 02:33:58 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: guile-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1NAZQj-0005x7-A0 for guile-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 18 Nov 2009 02:33:57 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:32770 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NAZQi-0003wM-56 for guile-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 17 Nov 2009 20:33:56 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NAZQe-0003vz-QV for guile-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Nov 2009 20:33:52 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NAZQZ-0003vP-Ch for guile-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Nov 2009 20:33:51 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=37877 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NAZQZ-0003vM-7v for guile-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Nov 2009 20:33:47 -0500 Original-Received: from mail.gmx.net ([213.165.64.20]:48782) by monty-python.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NAZQY-0004Mz-Jg for guile-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Nov 2009 20:33:47 -0500 Original-Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 18 Nov 2009 01:33:45 -0000 Original-Received: from 83-215-154-5.hage.dyn.salzburg-online.at (EHLO nathot.lan) [83.215.154.5] by mail.gmx.net (mp066) with SMTP; 18 Nov 2009 02:33:45 +0100 X-Authenticated: #3102804 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/uLeUA7NnuLcKZzBgcdyefFcULWcBesQpETPIpwW 2sCR2mzevu6dOs Original-Received: by nathot.lan (Postfix, from userid 121) id 3D0C43A6A0; Wed, 18 Nov 2009 02:33:44 +0100 (CET) Original-Received: from delenn.lan (delenn.lan [192.168.3.11]) by nathot.lan (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23FF73A693; Wed, 18 Nov 2009 02:33:26 +0100 (CET) Original-Received: by delenn.lan (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 100224A83EB; Wed, 18 Nov 2009 02:33:25 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <2bc5f8210911171255m5a731127idd6876d258584e25@mail.gmail.com> (Julian Graham's message of "Tue, 17 Nov 2009 15:55:52 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.1 (gnu/linux) X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 X-FuHaFi: 0.62 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-BeenThere: guile-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Developers list for Guile, the GNU extensibility library" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.lisp.guile.devel:9691 Archived-At: Julian Graham writes: > I probably should have said "rough prototype" instead of "working > prototype" -- the actual macro that transforms library definitions > into module definitions is kind of gross and uses datum->syntax a fair > amount where it probably doesn't need to / shouldn't. I'm no syncase > wizard. But I'm pretty sure it works for conventional libraries that > import and export macros and regular bindings. (What I worry about > are some of the hairier use cases of the whole "phased import" > mechanism -- like a binding that's imported at `meta' level 2 or > higher sharing a name with definition imported for use at runtime.) > IIRC, R6RS doesn't /require/ that implementations are able to differentiate bindings from different phases -- e.g. Ikarus essentially ignores phase specifications (implicit phasing -- there were some discussions about that on ikarus-users, which I can't find ATM, but [0] should sum the issue up nicely). [0] http://www.phyast.pitt.edu/~micheles/scheme/scheme21.html > What I'm mostly interested in is whether you guys think the version > and export patches are worth merging in some form or another -- my > assumption has been these are features we actually want for Guile's > module system. > Are you aware of SRFI-103? It got recently revised to leave out versions; not supporting them is an option, I guess. Quoting from R6RS: ,---- | When more than one library is identified by a library reference, the | choice of libraries is determined in some implementation-dependent | manner. | | To avoid problems such as incompatible types and replicated state, | implementations should prohibit the two libraries whose library names | consist of the same sequence of identifiers but whose versions do not | match to co-exist in the same program. `---- This makes me wonder if versions can be used (or rather be relied on) sensibly in portable libraries at all... Regards, Rotty -- Andreas Rottmann --