From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?Q?Linus_Bj=C3=B6rnstam?= Newsgroups: gmane.lisp.guile.devel Subject: Re: Add internal definitions to derived forms Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2023 22:38:02 +0100 Message-ID: <6288cbae-173f-4c1f-b46d-1af4ce02ec8b@app.fastmail.com> References: <2f38c5ea-0cb6-494e-b680-70b39c3291fb@app.fastmail.com> <87y1pqslab.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="12289"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.9.0-alpha0-85-gd6d859e0cf-fm-20230116.001-gd6d859e0 Cc: guile-devel@gnu.org To: "Greg Troxel" , =?UTF-8?Q?Ludovic_Court=C3=A8s?= Original-X-From: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Jan 25 22:38:53 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: guile-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pKnTo-00030Q-Hu for guile-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; 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Wed, 25 Jan 2023 16:38:21 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=66.111.4.26; envelope-from=linus.bjornstam@veryfast.biz; helo=out2-smtp.messagingengine.com X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: guile-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Developers list for Guile, the GNU extensibility library" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.lisp.guile.devel:21638 Archived-At: On Wed, 25 Jan 2023, at 16:38, Greg Troxel wrote: > My reaction, without thinking much, and being fuzzy on a lot of things > is that part of the point of guile is that it is Scheme which to me > means RnRS conformance. Of course it's not exactly and every other > Scheme impl is not exactly. But mostly I think that's a bug as it leads > to incompatible programs. Guile already has some nonstandard syntax extensions. Definitions in expression context in some places (all bodies, just not begin), cond extensions etc. I had > Does the new feature advance the goal of guile as an extension language? It makes guile more approachable for beginners. We have all written convoluted cond clauses that could have been a lot clearer with internal definitions. > Is this heading for inclusino in the next RnRS? No, but... bodies are now specified using letrec*. Allowing internal definitions is a small step away, but the only one I heard mentioning it was Marc. I suspect they are moving carefully. The reason r5rs did not include it was that bodies were specified in terms of letrec. That made internal definitions hard to pin down. Best regards Linus