From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Fabio Pesari Newsgroups: gmane.comp.gnu.guix.devel,gmane.lisp.guile.devel Subject: Re: Guix as a Guile package manager Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2016 17:00:46 +0100 Message-ID: <56912EAE.5050308@gnu.org> References: <5690E261.8000704@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1452355262 8777 80.91.229.3 (9 Jan 2016 16:01:02 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2016 16:01:02 +0000 (UTC) Cc: guix-devel , guile-devel To: "Thompson, David" Original-X-From: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jan 09 17:01:00 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: gcggd-guix-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1aHvwp-0006pK-8m for gcggd-guix-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 17:00:59 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41057 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aHvwo-0000Oi-QL for gcggd-guix-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 11:00:58 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:53144) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aHvwj-0000Mc-MP for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 11:00:54 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aHvwi-0006E7-PZ for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 11:00:53 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:37110) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aHvwc-00069w-Kp; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 11:00:46 -0500 Original-Received: from [87.19.29.194] (port=53373 helo=[192.168.1.5]) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1aHvwc-0000dt-1C; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 11:00:46 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Icedove/38.4.0 In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.comp.gnu.guix.devel:15044 gmane.lisp.guile.devel:18117 Archived-At: On 01/09/2016 04:30 PM, Thompson, David wrote: > > I don't think Guix is a good fit here, because there's simply no way > around the fact that Guix packages *must* contain the full dependency > graph for build-time and runtime dependencies. There's no way that > you could use, say, the Guile or GCC from your host system because > doing so invalidates the entire purpose and design of Guix. Thus, a > Debian user that tried to use a Guile-specific package manager based > on Guix would be surprised when it starts compiling its own glibc, > GCC, Guile, etc. So, I don't see anything worth extracting from Guix > to use to build a Guile-specific package manager. Hello David, and thank you for your answer! As a simple user, I didn't know enough about the finer points of Guix in this context so I really appreciate your answer. I thought some of Guix' package management functionalities could be worked into a less specific program but if it can't be done, it can't be done! > I encourage you to hack on Guildhall to make it more usable for your > needs. I've seen people work on dozens of package managers over the years and honestly, I don't feel like working on one unless it's officially part of the language or it already has mainstream adoption. It's a Catch 22, I know, but those projects all amount to re-inventing the wheel and trying to solve the same problems over and over again until they get abandoned because nobody uses them (like it happened with Guildhall, last updated in June). I know Guile was designed as an extension language so it is excused from not having a package manager, but with the latest developments and Guix in particular I thought the language was heading in a more general-purpose direction and that's why I posted this proposal.