From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Mike Gran Newsgroups: gmane.lisp.guile.devel Subject: Re: Replace ltdl with GLib's GModule Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2020 10:03:48 -0700 Message-ID: <20200327170348.GA11226@spikycactus.com> References: <20200324222429.GA2587085.ref@spikycactus.com> <20200324222429.GA2587085@spikycactus.com> <87o8si57ml.fsf@gnu.org> <83imiq7wrm.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="130550"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Ludovic =?iso-8859-1?Q?Court=E8s?= , guile-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Mar 27 18:04:35 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: guile-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jHsPL-000Xs9-EV for guile-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 27 Mar 2020 18:04:35 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:44598 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jHsPK-0004Qi-Bu for guile-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 27 Mar 2020 13:04:34 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:53050) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jHsOn-0004QP-8N for guile-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Mar 2020 13:04:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1jHsOm-0000ne-0P for guile-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Mar 2020 13:04:01 -0400 Original-Received: from sonic310-24.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com ([66.163.186.205]:44859) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1jHsOl-0000kY-Lt for guile-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Mar 2020 13:03:59 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1585328638; bh=ZKK0b3EJJFFFjW20Cu+tL0/2Pzh9k89tE4NRo4PR4Aw=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From:Subject; b=YcSvTk5C17x+E0bgejH/GcTjHamlPRzbhAIB+2CfjAxOa7O/v7Nr/qyzB8R76LNR92L/syqwlV9A5L/5iA1UUTX3XExJGr45A+LC3JCNOE9rg1PPCqFqL4LoDTsHdDRLOrlDGXU9nHmgraR/k1dMAQEfDpynT/Kj6Za9ry4bSP6TNzacU6deZXlUVudmCVjghoAeEzXArPS+MCGlUHDgzmZOIxL7qR+HdrEntp6ye2mkUEldBCm6LyYSb6c9tp2F2UcUqWQ7j0Qu76tY+Xdiv6qNJM0PROgTOk5D7IgxLx8RG+622Zr0T+1cRxR4Rdhg7fBeuAqI+/LBn24CM1Mucg== X-YMail-OSG: mIj10iYVM1lHPEZEzlkenwZqEPXSsFOrZTW4_hlZNoUeWzghQ5Cp5d_jq5pdSU7 N2oPmzIbEJNIJFE6y4uZG8RBcS1sny9Ry_n4OfukWtHMvdAoEETaG3buoZvzwI0Dg3TtLG8gUuwd jb14WRTYa.LrAUh4ZpKHyupZhXNxGbzYWJbBibdZovvtJ.3uZLgEg.rG_lNzLTrmA2etLgUhqVrN HzD6eDACUHtYoJJMkP.pNr_dGoOpkOQDkWwnX1FqplMNtrhv20cSx67dpHETccjVyFyzHXus7Iqc 6fTQsurZtrwXkgmQCa9bfwnLz8rw6UG.q4q7f5eFyOiOWZDeE8zb8iZaGBGHBI9_kq33vkRXlWjP 4mWEvCcBSQ5nCe5h2wTemfobj9Or9QNqq8xPF3fA5P1Ucpe5gBjDGKanL3Eb3qZK.3bqCF.mvSfJ GQhft12a0gijuEVj0rLgfMrxESZRi112FiQqwZnDVGOzx7OV3QeVjxIFv_kt51uYsp0_bfY.eE6M pSbiPRBV98QTho_TorypNPYHVZJaOU7QRlXyNnzYSVUwXIBkNLvrWU00wtA9eCrtic2uozqD95iy K_0ktpkY5TaD5g9vHqvFm3FrlaxsNzX..aZJSqNpGNkYaG5Yli0DCK3XLTPXEIj2GlKfnuu24eq5 Ze8kbCj9xPuihZEecxnMcs9bOKVlcaZFsDkygDH9PjXuBdUn8Ibf3Bz2YJInF6hRN8_Wa4RfnSAX jG5Hl22bZA3qV6kJCUbr5TJIVWE5Dh8MVHtlKzXS6kUi7HYUmFQQw52CLcnQ87UIb_LdZCs53lkf Uky98CcFJJNsMIzvkdlhBRN2MmqU4MdSG3D9ULGulf Original-Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic310.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Fri, 27 Mar 2020 17:03:58 +0000 Original-Received: by smtp421.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID ec970c79916e313b4603b1dc97dda3e6; Fri, 27 Mar 2020 17:03:54 +0000 (UTC) Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <83imiq7wrm.fsf@gnu.org> X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.15518 hermes Apache-HttpAsyncClient/4.1.4 (Java/1.8.0_242) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 66.163.186.205 X-BeenThere: guile-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Developers list for Guile, the GNU extensibility library" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guile-devel-bounces+guile-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "guile-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.lisp.guile.devel:20474 Archived-At: On Fri, Mar 27, 2020 at 04:27:57PM +0300, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > I think we should either fix ltdl (probably less work than porting Guile > > to GModule, but also less exciting) or have a very basic wrapper around > > dlopen instead of using ltdl (I think Andy had made experiments in that > > direction.) > > If you drop ltdl, the MinGW port of Guile will be broken, as dlopen > there is not guaranteed to exist (it exists in one flavor of MinGW, > but not in the other, which is the most popular one, AFAIK). > > So my recommendation would be to fix ltdl. > I must be said that the libtool mailing list appears extremely conservative with respect to change. I haven't evaluated it on a technical level, but I do see small patches in GModule to handle things like UWP, while the last technical change to libltdl was probably around 2011. If GModule is up to date, it looks like there are only three families of dynamic linking that remain: dlopen for UNIX-Likes, AIX's dlopen of AIX-format .ar archives, and Microsoft's LoadLibrary. MacOS's dyld is gone. Maybe when I have a moment, I'll strip GLib from GModule to see what it looks like, or perhaps see what new information GModule contains that could be flowed down to ltdl. Not that I expect Guile to necessarily incorporate it, but, because I find it interesting. But, I don't see myself as finding any fun in interacting with the libtool mailing list, so I probably won't do that. Regards, Mike Gran