From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Leo Famulari Newsgroups: gmane.comp.gnu.guix.devel,gmane.lisp.guile.devel Subject: Re: Guix as a Guile package manager Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2016 15:42:27 -0500 Message-ID: <20160109204227.GD30687@jasmine> References: <5690E261.8000704@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1452372161 325 80.91.229.3 (9 Jan 2016 20:42:41 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2016 20:42:41 +0000 (UTC) Cc: guix-devel@gnu.org, guile-devel@gnu.org To: Fabio Pesari Original-X-From: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jan 09 21:42:30 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: gcggd-guix-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1aI0LG-0005zw-J3 for gcggd-guix-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 21:42:30 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42894 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aI0LF-0004qp-S8 for gcggd-guix-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 15:42:29 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:46521) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aI0LB-0004qL-I4 for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 15:42:26 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aI0L8-0007X9-Ay for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 15:42:25 -0500 Original-Received: from out4-smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.28]:55693) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aI0L8-0007Wz-7E for guix-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 15:42:22 -0500 Original-Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0946020282; Sat, 9 Jan 2016 15:42:22 -0500 (EST) Original-Received: from frontend1 ([10.202.2.160]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Sat, 09 Jan 2016 15:42:22 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=famulari.name; h= cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-sasl-enc :x-sasl-enc; s=mesmtp; bh=B5ozZAP/Pbd8Ye4K1DnLCqJ5A5g=; b=U+7RpD 1944r/Bzkqwe7XKQdJXWOKc6pAhcioVZpMimykk+6v/HmalQY4gnczUr8MyAb27c 2QY1STtjHsWxSC+2KZR/Q5jc4Bg4I6R9T90uwNz310NwnuznBbVa2V76o5vpEh21 L2EKLx8Q5bLGPkA8XFEbO/Vv/+NwXAfomdDbM= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :subject:to:x-sasl-enc:x-sasl-enc; s=smtpout; bh=B5ozZAP/Pbd8Ye4 K1DnLCqJ5A5g=; b=SywMNsBwZ8IJPMTtLWdLBcKVb7RMN1wFmpkMfxTrfhJWB2K MyN1ja2uKFmZx6JLGuR+D7xiUmYBVuSRFacl2sLxJiGL4WmSnAM0vz/sahq7qEqn XpSL+8lzGVLpm8nUi5pKzZ6QMPnSB8llDBxQud8ZNYSsKW5gt8/QDJYmpEGE= X-Sasl-enc: VCgQTP5cNhR1KGTTi+6sIiy+YFnmavnUA1o6QffZgtH+ 1452372141 Original-Received: from localhost (c-69-249-5-231.hsd1.pa.comcast.net [69.249.5.231]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id BCB57C016C4; Sat, 9 Jan 2016 15:42:21 -0500 (EST) Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <5690E261.8000704@gnu.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.24 (2015-08-30) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 66.111.4.28 X-BeenThere: guix-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Development of GNU Guix and the GNU System distribution." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: guix-devel-bounces+gcggd-guix-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.comp.gnu.guix.devel:15056 gmane.lisp.guile.devel:18120 Archived-At: On Sat, Jan 09, 2016 at 11:35:13AM +0100, Fabio Pesari wrote: > Package managers have been immensely successful in increasing the > popularity of programming languages - think about Perl's CPAN or Ruby's > Gem. But Guile doesn't a package manager, and that in my opinion slows > down its adoption. > > The Guix repos distribute a lot of useful Guile libraries (like > guile-json or guile-opengl) which can't be found on most distro > repositories and it already provides Guile APIs and package management > capabilities...my question is, can Guix be forked into a full-blown > Guile package manager like gem from Ruby? > > I know that an argument could be made that Guix can already be used in > this way, but there are many Scheme coders who don't need a system-wide > package manager and would rather use a program that can manage Guile > packages under a user root like ~/.guile and allow them to easily > distribute their packages (something like Python's virtualenvs would > also be useful). > > Perhaps some of the Guix code can be moved to a library, so that both > the Guix and the Guile package manager binaries can reuse the same code. > Moving Guix' core to a library would also facilitate its inclusion in > things like PackageKit, as well as make it easier to create front-ends. I think the main problem with this idea is that the whole point of Guix / Nix is to manage the entire dependency graph — from the package you are trying to install and use all the way down the tar used to unpack the sources, the GCC used to compile everything, etc. There is not much point in using Guix to only manage the very top-level of the graph (the Guile modules you'd want to install) because by not managing the entire graph from top to bottom, the Guix system would just break as the unmanaged dependencies are changed the OS's package manager or the user. There really isn't anything left when you try to split up Guix in the way you are requesting. > > I'm not a package management expert so I'm not sure this idea is > feasible but I would really like Guile to become more > popular, and this I think would be a step in the right direction. >