From: Mike Gran <spk121@yahoo.com>
To: Bruce Korb <bkorb@gnu.org>, "guile-devel@gnu.org" <guile-devel@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Guile: What's wrong with this?
Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 15:22:41 -0800 (PST) [thread overview]
Message-ID: <1325719361.74748.YahooMailNeo@web37902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4F04D01D.5050801@gnu.org>
> From: Bruce Korb <bkorb@gnu.org>
>>> Which is the higher priority, language purity or ease of use?
>> That is a loaded question, as it presupposes ease of use is always the
>> same thing as impurity e.g. ...
> Absolutely not. Making decisions is always about trade-offs,
> otherwise it is not really a decision. Should you give preference
> to language aesthetics, or preference to ease of use *when*
> there is a divergence? More often than not, language purity
> (consistency) *improves* ease of use. Here we are looking at
> something that does not appear to me to improve ease of use.
> You have to go to some extra trouble to be certain that a string
> value that you have assigned to an SCM is not read only.
> That is not convenience. If Guile were to implement copy on write,
> then the user would not have to care whether a string were
> shared read only or not. It would be easier to use. The only code
> that would care at all would be the Guile internals. (Where it
> belongs -- my completely unhumble opinion :)
Well, I've read all the posts in this thread, and I was pretty aware
of the arguments about read-only strings before this. So since I
have little left to contribute, I'll sign off with one final
statement about it...
I agree completely with Bruce's statement above.
The mutability of strings in Guile 1.8 was a feature, not a weakness.
Even though it wasn't properly implemented, as Mark pointed out, it
did what I meant every time I used it.
I believe that mutability should be the default in all data types.
Creating an immutable compound data type -- be it a string, pair,
vector or whatever -- should never be the default, and should always
be the case that requires extra syntax.
R{5,6,7}RS disagrees with me on that, of course. I think R{5,6,7}RS
is wrong.
I understand the efficiency argument for immutable strings (and pairs).
I don't care, because Guile has never been slow for anything I've asked
it to do.
That, I guess, is my completely unhumble opinion. :)
Regards,
Mike
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2012-01-04 23:22 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 117+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2012-01-03 4:08 What's wrong with this? Bruce Korb
2012-01-03 15:03 ` Mike Gran
2012-01-03 16:26 ` Guile: " Bruce Korb
2012-01-03 16:30 ` Mike Gran
2012-01-03 22:24 ` Ludovic Courtès
2012-01-03 23:15 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-03 23:33 ` Ludovic Courtès
2012-01-04 0:55 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-04 3:12 ` Noah Lavine
2012-01-04 17:37 ` bytevector -- was: " Bruce Korb
2012-01-04 21:17 ` Ludovic Courtès
2012-01-04 22:36 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-05 0:01 ` Ludovic Courtès
2012-01-05 18:36 ` non-reproduction of initial issue -- was: " Bruce Korb
2012-01-05 18:50 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-04 12:19 ` Ian Price
2012-01-04 17:16 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-04 17:21 ` Andy Wingo
2012-01-04 17:39 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-04 21:52 ` Ian Price
2012-01-04 22:18 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-04 23:22 ` Mike Gran [this message]
2012-01-04 23:59 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-05 17:22 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-05 18:13 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-05 19:02 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-05 20:24 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-05 22:42 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-06 1:02 ` Mike Gran
2012-01-06 1:41 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-06 2:38 ` Noah Lavine
2012-01-06 13:37 ` Mike Gran
2012-01-06 14:11 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-06 18:13 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-06 19:06 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-06 19:19 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-06 20:03 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-07 16:13 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-07 17:35 ` mutable interfaces - was: " Bruce Korb
2012-01-07 17:47 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-07 18:30 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-07 18:55 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-06 22:23 ` Guile BUG: " Bruce Korb
2012-01-06 23:11 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-06 23:35 ` Andy Wingo
2012-01-06 23:41 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-07 15:00 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-07 15:27 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-07 16:38 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-07 17:39 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-09 15:41 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-09 17:27 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-09 18:32 ` Andy Wingo
2012-01-09 19:48 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-07 15:47 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-07 17:07 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-07 14:35 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-07 15:20 ` Mike Gran
2012-01-07 22:25 ` Ludovic Courtès
2012-01-10 9:13 ` The empty string and other empty strings Ludovic Courtès
2012-01-10 11:28 ` Mike Gran
2012-01-10 13:03 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-10 13:09 ` Mike Gran
2012-01-10 15:41 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-10 15:48 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-10 16:15 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-12 22:33 ` Ludovic Courtès
2012-01-13 9:27 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-13 16:39 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-13 17:36 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-16 8:26 ` Marijn
2012-01-16 8:47 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-20 21:31 ` Andy Wingo
2012-01-10 14:10 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-10 12:21 ` Mike Gran
2012-01-10 12:27 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-10 16:34 ` Ludovic Courtès
2012-01-10 17:04 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-06 23:28 ` Guile BUG: What's wrong with this? Bruce Korb
2012-01-07 20:57 ` Guile: " Ian Price
2012-01-08 5:05 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-06 9:23 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-05 7:22 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-04 22:46 ` Ludovic Courtès
2012-01-04 3:04 ` Mike Gran
2012-01-04 9:35 ` nalaginrut
2012-01-04 9:41 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-04 21:07 ` Ludovic Courtès
2012-01-04 10:03 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-04 14:29 ` Mike Gran
2012-01-04 14:45 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-04 16:47 ` Andy Wingo
2012-01-04 17:14 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-04 17:32 ` Andy Wingo
2012-01-04 17:49 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-04 18:09 ` Andy Wingo
2012-01-04 17:30 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-04 17:44 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-04 18:26 ` Ian Price
2012-01-04 18:48 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-04 19:29 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-04 20:20 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-04 23:19 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-04 23:28 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-07 15:43 ` Fixed string corruption bugs (was Guile: What's wrong with this?) Mark H Weaver
2012-01-07 16:19 ` Fixed string corruption bugs Andy Wingo
2012-01-04 18:31 ` Guile: What's wrong with this? Mark H Weaver
2012-01-04 18:43 ` Andy Wingo
2012-01-04 19:29 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-04 19:43 ` Andy Wingo
2012-01-04 20:08 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-04 20:14 ` David Kastrup
2012-01-04 20:56 ` Andy Wingo
2012-01-04 21:30 ` Bruce Korb
2012-01-04 17:19 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-05 4:24 ` Mark H Weaver
2012-01-04 22:37 ` Ludovic Courtès
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