From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Mohsen BANAN Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: just-the-text Emacs frame Date: Fri, 03 Jun 2011 08:09:39 -0700 Organization: ByStar Federation of Autonomous Libre Services -- http://www.by-star.net Message-ID: References: <87aaebbndz.fsf@lifelogs.com> <4DDDA5A7.6040109@siege-engine.com> <87boyp5vyi.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87mxi8xq6y.fsf@lifelogs.com> <874o4ebtq0.fsf_-_@lifelogs.com> <87vcwpsa6y.fsf@lifelogs.com> <871uzccr2k.fsf@lifelogs.com> <878vtkb06y.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87k4d49c4x.fsf@lifelogs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1307114180 23232 80.91.229.12 (3 Jun 2011 15:16:20 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 15:16:20 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jun 03 17:16:17 2011 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1QSW6h-0003rC-MQ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 03 Jun 2011 17:16:15 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:54511 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QSW6g-000216-Fk for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 03 Jun 2011 11:16:14 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:33595) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QSW0S-0000KX-69 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 03 Jun 2011 11:09:50 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QSW0O-0005V6-NT for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 03 Jun 2011 11:09:47 -0400 Original-Received: from 0016.bacs.by-star.net ([198.62.92.166]:54531) by eggs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QSW0O-0005UF-37 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 03 Jun 2011 11:09:44 -0400 Original-Received: (qmail 20048 invoked from network); 3 Jun 2011 08:05:11 -0700 Original-Received: from 192.168.0.187 ([192.168.0.187]) by 0016.bacs.by-star.net ([198.62.92.166]) with ESMTP via TCP; 03 Jun 2011 15:05:11 -0000 X-Form-Name: murl-sendlink-toCloseFriends In-Reply-To: <87k4d49c4x.fsf@lifelogs.com> (Ted Zlatanov's message of "Thu, 02 Jun 2011 16:06:22 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.0.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-Received-From: 198.62.92.166 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:140127 Archived-At: >>>>> On Thu, 02 Jun 2011 16:06:22 -0500, Ted Zlatanov said: Ted> On Thu, 02 Jun 2011 13:19:49 -0700 Mohsen BANAN wrote: MB> Panel of Tiles Example: MB> ----------------------- MB> Consider that we were trying to mimic what MB> Windows 7 Mobile is doing in: MB> http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2010/02/02-15-10winphone2.jpg Ted> I'll reply to the rest later, but please let's not try to mimic Ted> anything. If we create something, let it be the right fit for our Ted> needs, not a rehash of other people's ideas. These tiles are just large Ted> buttons with HTML and other dynamic content, aren't they? Emacs can do Ted> it 100x better, and we don't need kinetic scolling or visual candy to Ted> make it useful. Ted> I bring this up here because emacs-panel.el is intended to fix some of Ted> the things I dislike about Gnome and other desktop environments, Ted> especially how they mimic the Windows and Mac OS X desktop environments Ted> and how expensive their resource usage is. So I hope you will agree. My goal has been to add considerations for emacs on handsets (small screen + touch) into the mix. In that context I am convinced that tiles, larger buttons, keypads and full screen menus have a place towards adapting emacs to handsets. This does not mean that we should abandon the emacs paradigm and mimic the iPhone/Android/WinMob/... paradigms. So, I am proposing experimentation with the following hierarchy: - Bare-Frames (no mini-buf, no menu, ...) - Related Windows - Panels (Collection of Tiles) - Tiles (Optionally Live and Active) If such facilities were in place, I think we could move towards making emacs more usable on a handset. The purpose of my citing the Windows 7 Mobile screen was to point applicability of the above to a common full screen menu model. Let's now throw Microsoft Windows 7 Mobile completely out of the picture. Consider use of emacs's calc on a handset. In that case, the prefered UI is likely : (calc-keypad) The basic structure of (calc-keypad) is: - 2 related windows in the current frame. - A custom made text grid functioning as a keypad In this case, I am saying let's add to emacs necessary abstraction and facilities so that: - The two related windows can fit properly in a Bare-Frame without any waste of screen space on the handset. - Instead of a custom made grid functioning as a keypad let's provide tiles such that keypads are done nicer and better. If these ideas fit in the direction that you are headed, please consider my requests. Thanks. ...Mohsen