From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Yann Hodique Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Contributing LLVM.org patches to gud.el Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 07:42:50 -0800 Message-ID: References: <87mw4rxkzv.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <874mqvf4dj.fsf@panthera.terpri.org> <87sieeru2k.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <87oap2rq9o.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1423583127 9080 80.91.229.3 (10 Feb 2015 15:45:27 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 15:45:27 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Feb 10 16:45:15 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1YLCzz-00048J-7u for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 16:45:15 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:40397 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YLCzy-0005tZ-KZ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 10:45:14 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:54332) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YLCzv-0005tI-1g for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 10:45:11 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YLCzr-0007Eg-1K for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 10:45:10 -0500 Original-Received: from plane.gmane.org ([80.91.229.3]:41255) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YLCzq-0007DD-R8 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 10:45:06 -0500 Original-Received: from list by plane.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1YLCzp-00043r-D8 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 16:45:05 +0100 Original-Received: from c-76-103-208-186.hsd1.ca.comcast.net ([76.103.208.186]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 16:45:05 +0100 Original-Received: from yann.hodique by c-76-103-208-186.hsd1.ca.comcast.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 16:45:05 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 41 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: c-76-103-208-186.hsd1.ca.comcast.net User-Agent: Gnus/5.13001 (Ma Gnus v0.10) Emacs/24.4 (darwin) Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAAAXNSR0IArs4c6QAAACpQTFRF HBgXPyYdPSkeMiwmRkJBYT4sik8zZF1XqWpMx2RDk42MzYRYtrGw09DVySZyaAAAAklJREFUOMuF 0z9v00AUAPCHr/kANgowOi6hjFbOCImp1CdF6kaUCwEmkBJSdYmUSBZRGRMsske1MlKIFKVr5XAr U1TPSFX6XXjvnKp2KOLG97v3x3dnuP7Hgv/B+vLyLlivZkGwSP6GlXABvHmyDese0GIn2zBzNYCX bEGagOswycG6ewMsyMEVVTJMiyQHv2lzuTOSNrDPWfhF8FSpuGXt5IB6s6bCNfLOt8FoEMT1JAv7 wFz25E7gtqFLqS856IJhl481/MyN27tnGe+wc1uprzn4fvS+MFYxwvDtLcyT1Y9oUhyri3ZHtTIg B7NP0WmDMo7VcJABKRvRtKNbq3hxC21ZKx2pMAWVgQt5H95MNSynKnMfZTzTQkSwjKLpPAN1H+CB zogmYaa5ED7eUzMeY+tw9HqRAcEBnoUhxYfFQZIBelRNhGjSKj6cb14kBH3hY5dCGI+XpzXTebzJ gY+CC47FHiGENQdXVfeBuvA55y5eYRgOnTJRdXC+6eFTiiHbHyplKVGoHGDQw1okzi5BCcUbXANn KL4WYAeyZJomJu0l4ALKZvlCvkrBOaG3dhOvdtlLjJt6AP2UN3DosoppOhr20v+Cwq4ncE8JwaLB gJpyPa/n0mQIJn0m0EExTHE5HgxUHAvnsjT41ARTnu8juAaUML5bSQHn8vkLBGYDUCkLS+tD577H qwjcpl8Le+BmIWgnHkrgws5BCvjTMbpaAsHPcK6+jXNhLfqGQND4XHhn4Ik5T8HCzKu+Bk98qwq+ 6AFOimPZ8Aem5xXrk2gG/wAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== Cancel-Lock: sha1:dUACtYNiW49zdDHjV0NaUc4rL7k= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 80.91.229.3 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:182807 Archived-At: >>>>> "Helmut" == Helmut Eller writes: >> Tell them to dissolve their own community and >> commit ritual suicide? > Changing the license would hardly be suicide. Apple could still be the > main contributor and they managed to survive even when they had to use > GCC. It would piss off NVIDIA but it might attract some other > individuals who don't like the idea that NVIDIA profits from their > contributions. Either way, you don't make those decisions. I find that claim (that a license change would annoy the NVIDIAs of the world) very odd. After all, the core of the entire issue, and this whole discussion, is that the FSF did object to *technical possibilities* in order to counter those same people, effectively deeming the GPL alone insufficient to reach that goal. So now we cannot possibly be suggesting that slapping a GPL sticker on LLVM could solve the "issue", can we? I mean, one (at least...) of the following has to be true: - the modularity of LLVM (GPL or not) allows access to the internals of a compilation phase in a textual form, making it easy for people to pipe a non-free component where they fancy - the GPL is enough to push non-free components away (or is the best we can do anyway), and we've been wasting time and opportunities protecting something that doesn't exist Bottom line, we cannot say that a GPL compiler (GCC) made modular would have been a problem, but that a modular compiler (LLVM) made GPL would be a solution. In the end, they'd be both modular and GPL, right? Thanks, Yann. -- Speak the truth. That is always much easier, and is often the most powerful argument. -- Bene Gesserit Axiom