From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Kastrup Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Options menu Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:55:13 +0100 Message-ID: References: <010e01c52c0d$ac93ede0$0200a8c0@sedrcw11488> <01c52c6d$Blat.v2.4$713e68a0@zahav.net.il> <01c52c99$Blat.v2.4$0c75eac0@zahav.net.il> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1111248116 10104 80.91.229.2 (19 Mar 2005 16:01:56 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:01:56 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Mar 19 17:01:56 2005 Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DCgOa-00039I-WA for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 19 Mar 2005 17:01:49 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DCgfJ-0005aq-FW for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 19 Mar 2005 11:19:05 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1DCgdp-0004Mk-2m for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Mar 2005 11:17:33 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1DCgdj-0004IQ-8M for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Mar 2005 11:17:27 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DCgdh-0004G2-PE for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Mar 2005 11:17:25 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.164] (helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1DCgIM-0000Xm-Ij for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Mar 2005 10:55:22 -0500 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lola.goethe.zz) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1DCgIL-0004J5-QF; Sat, 19 Mar 2005 10:55:22 -0500 Original-To: Eli Zaretskii In-Reply-To: <01c52c99$Blat.v2.4$0c75eac0@zahav.net.il> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 19 Mar 2005 17:32:47 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.0.50 (gnu/linux) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org X-MailScanner-To: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:34775 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:34775 "Eli Zaretskii" writes: >> Cc: "Lennart Borgman" , >> emacs-devel@gnu.org >> From: David Kastrup >> Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 12:24:34 +0100 >> >> > When Emacs 21.1 was released, many users complained about the >> > changed menu-bar structure, even though the new structure was >> > generally better, certainly more standard-compliant, and had many >> > useful additions. Still, they complained. There's a lesson to be >> > learned here, IMHO: significant changes in the menu bar should only >> > be done for a very good reason. >> >> Uh, Eli? Reality check. The last released menu structure is from the >> year 2001 or so. > > It was redesigned in 2001, but it was last released just a few weeks > ago, with Emacs 21.4. I just took a look at Emacs 21.4 and noticed that it indeed is quite similar to what we have now except for a few additions (New file, Hide/Show, Blinking Cursor, CUA mode and some others). Somehow I was of the opinion that the big redesign happened post-21.1. >> No matter _what_ we will release next, it will have significant >> changes all over the board. > > Not in the menu-bar's menu structure, AFAIK. > >> Consistency and cleanliness _are_ good reasons. > > Apparently, not good enough for quite a few users. That was what I > was trying to tell above, obviously with no success. Well, since Hide/Show is an addition since the last release, renaming it to "Appearance" would not be a compatibility consideration. And moving blink-cursor-mode inside of it would make the menu _more_ similar to what we had previously. >> the current structure _is_ already completely dissimilar to the >> last released one. > > Unless I miss a lot of changes, I don't see how the current CVS is > ``completely dissimilar'' to v21.4 as far as the menu bar is > concerned. The changes are quite small. You are correct. Sorry for being confused about that. -- David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum