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From: David Kastrup <dak@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Making Emacs more newbie friendly
Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 15:31:35 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <x5mzszbtbs.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> (raw)
In-Reply-To: uhdj721oo.fsf@rk-speed-rugby.dk

Brian Elmegaard <brian@rk-speed-rugby.dk> writes:

> "Eli Zaretskii" <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
>
>> Please be specific; slogans are not useful when you are criticizing a
>
> Four fundamental issues would be: [1] Possibility for horizontal
> scroll,

C-x <  and C-x >

> [2] sizeable and cascadable windows instead of buffers inside the
> same frame,

Windows _are_ sizable, and what is displayed _is_ a window, not a
buffer (you can have buffers that are not displayed, or buffers
displyed in several windows at once).  Drag an unused spot of any
modeline in a split frame (C-x 2) up and down or use C-x ^ to enlarge.
If you split windows vertically (with C-x 3), drag the point in the
mode line under the scrollbar left and right.

> [3] heavy extension of the icon toolbars and [4] distinction between
> 'open' and 'new' file.

The problems with "new" (basically nameless buffers) are:

a) There is no associated mode.  Emacs' most important property is
that it has editing modes and syntax highlighting and keybindings for
most tasks readily available.  It will almost always be easier to
specify a file name to work with than the name of an Emacs mode.

b) There is no associated file name.  When exiting and saving
automatically (like the desktop package does), Emacs has no place to
put the file.

c) There is no associated autosave file.  If you crash after two hours
of work, your work will get lost.

d) Lots of modes offer running/compiling/testing your program using
external tools that need accessible files.

In short: I don't see how Emacs can benefit from that distinction.

-- 
David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum

  reply	other threads:[~2005-03-19 14:31 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 123+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2005-03-18 21:12 Making Emacs more newbie friendly PT
2005-03-18 21:57 ` Pascal Bourguignon
2005-03-19  5:40   ` PT
2005-03-19  7:57     ` rgb
2005-03-19  9:51       ` David Kastrup
2005-03-19 10:46         ` Steinar Børmer
2005-03-19 11:01           ` David Kastrup
2005-03-20  0:42             ` Steinar Børmer
2005-03-19 20:16         ` Miles Bader
     [not found]         ` <mailman.4427.1111265353.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-19 20:53           ` David Kastrup
2005-03-19 10:56       ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]       ` <mailman.4380.1111231068.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-19 14:23         ` PT
2005-03-19 15:08           ` David Kastrup
2005-03-19 15:45           ` Eli Zaretskii
2005-03-19 10:47     ` Eli Zaretskii
2005-03-19 14:34       ` nfreimann
2005-03-19 15:49         ` Gian Uberto Lauri
2005-03-19 16:13           ` nfreimann
     [not found]           ` <mailman.4406.1111250911.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-19 19:12             ` Shawn Betts
2005-03-19 19:35               ` David Kastrup
2005-03-19 21:00                 ` Miles Bader
     [not found]                 ` <mailman.4435.1111267700.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-19 22:42                   ` David Kastrup
2005-03-19 15:50         ` Eli Zaretskii
2005-03-19 12:42     ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2005-03-19 14:56       ` PT
2005-03-19 15:37         ` David Kastrup
2005-03-19 17:45         ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2005-03-19 18:07           ` PT
2005-03-19 18:15             ` David Kastrup
2005-03-19 18:24               ` PT
2005-03-19 18:34                 ` David Kastrup
2005-04-09 18:01         ` Nathan Hess
     [not found]     ` <mailman.4378.1111230698.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-19 13:41       ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-19 14:31         ` David Kastrup [this message]
2005-03-19 16:04           ` Lee Sau Dan
2005-03-20 12:33             ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-20 17:33               ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2005-03-21  7:39                 ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-21 10:07                   ` Joe Corneli
2005-03-21 11:27                   ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2005-03-22 11:25                     ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-21 11:54                   ` Klaus Straubinger
2005-03-21 12:37                   ` David Kastrup
2005-03-20 12:27           ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-20 12:47             ` Jason Rumney
2005-03-21 18:30               ` Drew Adams
2005-03-19 15:37         ` Eli Zaretskii
2005-03-19 17:09         ` Stefan Monnier
2005-03-20 12:42           ` Brian Elmegaard
     [not found]         ` <mailman.4399.1111247782.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-20 12:39           ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-20 20:27             ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]             ` <mailman.4504.1111351877.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-20 21:05               ` David Kastrup
2005-03-21  8:11               ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-21 19:56                 ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]                 ` <mailman.4626.1111436194.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-22 11:33                   ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-19 14:52       ` PT
2005-03-19 15:14         ` David Hansen
2005-03-19 15:33         ` David Kastrup
2005-03-19 16:00           ` PT
2005-03-19 16:22             ` David Kastrup
2005-03-19 16:57               ` PT
2005-03-19 17:16                 ` David Kastrup
2005-03-19 17:55                   ` PT
2005-03-19 18:03                     ` David Kastrup
2005-03-20 12:52                       ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-20 17:44                         ` David Kastrup
2005-03-20 21:49                           ` Alan Mackenzie
2005-03-22 11:46                             ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-22 13:09                               ` David Kastrup
2005-03-23  7:29                                 ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-21  8:17                           ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-19 18:01                   ` PT
2005-03-19 20:45                     ` Miles Bader
2005-03-20 17:43                     ` Alan Mackenzie
2005-03-19 18:05                 ` Shawn Betts
2005-03-19 18:15                   ` PT
2005-03-20 17:51                 ` Alan Mackenzie
2005-03-19 17:17             ` Eli Zaretskii
2005-03-19 23:16             ` Pascal Bourguignon
2005-03-20 11:49           ` Steinar Børmer
2005-03-20 13:06             ` Floyd L. Davidson
2005-03-19 16:05         ` Eli Zaretskii
2005-03-19 18:16         ` Shawn Betts
2005-03-19 23:34           ` Pascal Bourguignon
2005-03-20  0:45           ` David Kastrup
     [not found]         ` <mailman.4404.1111249572.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-20 11:51           ` Steinar Børmer
2005-03-20 16:31         ` ken
     [not found]         ` <mailman.4485.1111338015.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-20 23:35           ` Floyd L. Davidson
2005-03-21  4:44             ` Sean Richards
2005-03-21 11:00               ` Floyd L. Davidson
2005-03-22 20:33                 ` Sean Richards
2005-03-19 15:45     ` Pascal Bourguignon
2005-03-19 15:54       ` Gian Uberto Lauri
2005-03-19 17:25       ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]       ` <mailman.4413.1111254615.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-19 23:33         ` Pascal Bourguignon
2005-03-20  4:37           ` Eli Zaretskii
2005-03-20  9:07             ` Gian Uberto Lauri
2005-03-20 11:30               ` nfreimann
2005-03-20 12:16                 ` Gian Uberto Lauri
     [not found]                 ` <mailman.4474.1111322832.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-20 18:04                   ` Joe Bush
2005-03-21  8:23                     ` Brian Elmegaard
     [not found]               ` <mailman.4470.1111319220.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-20 13:01                 ` Floyd L. Davidson
2005-03-20 17:37                 ` David Kastrup
     [not found]           ` <mailman.4443.1111294657.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-20 15:29             ` Pascal Bourguignon
2005-03-20 15:58               ` Joe Corneli
     [not found]               ` <mailman.4479.1111335526.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-20 20:33                 ` Jochen Küpper
2005-03-20 23:50                   ` Joe Corneli
2005-03-20 12:59       ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-20 17:45         ` David Kastrup
2005-03-21  8:19           ` Brian Elmegaard
2005-03-19 18:42     ` Shawn Betts
2005-03-19 19:27       ` David Kastrup
2005-03-20  6:55       ` Joe Corneli
2005-03-18 22:11 ` Peter Dyballa
2005-03-19 17:17 ` Jason Rumney
2005-03-19 18:10   ` Floyd L. Davidson
2005-03-22  1:59     ` Cristian Gutierrez
2005-03-21  9:56 ` Mathias Dahl
2005-03-21 19:23 ` Peter K. Lee
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2005-03-21 12:53 nfreimann
2005-03-21 15:22 ` Joe Corneli
     [not found] <mailman.4566.1111411378.32256.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2005-03-21 13:21 ` Klaus Straubinger
2005-03-21 21:44 ` Miles Bader

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