From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: YAMAMOTO Mitsuharu Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Changes 2009-07-15/16 in branch? Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 09:53:41 +0900 Organization: Faculty of Science, Chiba University Message-ID: References: <4A692E0A.9060108@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.6 - "Maruoka") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1248742451 24935 80.91.229.12 (28 Jul 2009 00:54:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 00:54:11 +0000 (UTC) Cc: adrian.b.robert@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, jasonr@gnu.org To: rms@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jul 28 02:54:03 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1MVax7-0007zy-VY for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 28 Jul 2009 02:54:02 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41630 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MVax7-0001mN-4h for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 27 Jul 2009 20:54:01 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MVax2-0001lz-I3 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Jul 2009 20:53:56 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MVawx-0001kV-Ds for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Jul 2009 20:53:55 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=34911 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MVawx-0001kS-Bx for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 27 Jul 2009 20:53:51 -0400 Original-Received: from mathmail.math.s.chiba-u.ac.jp ([133.82.132.2]:62015) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1MVawp-0004Rs-NK; Mon, 27 Jul 2009 20:53:44 -0400 Original-Received: from church.math.s.chiba-u.ac.jp (church [133.82.132.36]) by mathmail.math.s.chiba-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0E222C40; Tue, 28 Jul 2009 09:53:41 +0900 (JST) In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.14.0 (Africa) SEMI/1.14.6 (Maruoka) FLIM/1.14.8 (=?ISO-8859-4?Q?Shij=F2?=) APEL/10.6 Emacs/22.3 (sparc-sun-solaris2.8) MULE/5.0 (SAKAKI) X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: NetBSD 3.0 (DF) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:113263 Archived-At: >>>>> On Mon, 27 Jul 2009 13:41:04 -0400, Richard Stallman said: > What I'm concerning about with respect to the GNU policy is the > "alpha-component" (or maybe "alpha-channel" is more familiar) > support, which was added only for Cocoa. > Alpha-component/alpha-channel controls translucency of colors by > specifying how opaque it is. > Is this a feature users might actually want to use? I don't see > what it is good for. Can someone explain what a user might want to > do with this? Emacs 23 already has a frame opacity control feature whose design/implementation is different from what I mentioned above. I guess this was added because they considered that some users would want this kind of feature: Quote etc/NEWS: *** Emacs can now set the frame opacity. The opacity of a frame can be controlled by setting the `alpha' frame parameter. This only takes effect on a compositing window manager for the X Window System, such as Compiz, Beryl and Compiz Fusion, on Mac OS X, or on Windows 2000 and later versions of Windows. The alpha parameter should be an integer between 0 (transparent) and 100 (opaque), or a float number between 0.0 and 1.0. It can also be a cons cell (ACTIVE . INACTIVE), where ACTIVE is the opacity of an active frame and INACTIVE is the opacity of non-active frames. The variable `frame-alpha-lower-limit' defines a lower bound for the opacity; the default is 20. Some find its effect unsatisfactory because it makes both foreground and background colors translucent. Adrian says the alpha-component support in the NS port is superior and actually the latter can make background translucent while keeping foreground opaque. Actually the implementation of alpha-component support in the NS port has some annoying glitch as I pointed out in http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2009-07/msg01340.html . I think it's ridiculous to add such a feature to the release version * without broader discussion about the specification for such a general (i.e., non platform-specific) feature. * with a premature implementation only for a non-free platform. * with a risk of compatibility breakage in future. * with a risk of infringing the GNU policy. YAMAMOTO Mitsuharu mituharu@math.s.chiba-u.ac.jp