From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Glenn Morris Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Bug tracker choices for Emacs. Date: Fri, 07 Aug 2009 15:34:24 -0400 Message-ID: References: <87ws5ij2rw.fsf@canonical.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1249674369 11698 80.91.229.12 (7 Aug 2009 19:46:09 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 7 Aug 2009 19:46:09 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Karl Fogel Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Aug 07 21:46:02 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1MZVO5-0003uu-1Z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 07 Aug 2009 21:46:02 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40502 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MZVO3-00062E-Hp for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 07 Aug 2009 15:45:59 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MZVNv-0005zd-Iq for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 07 Aug 2009 15:45:51 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MZVNr-0005uE-JF for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 07 Aug 2009 15:45:51 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=49306 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MZVNr-0005u6-E6 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 07 Aug 2009 15:45:47 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]:60103) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1MZVNq-00033s-Ea for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 07 Aug 2009 15:45:47 -0400 Original-Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1MZVCq-0001fN-AW; Fri, 07 Aug 2009 15:34:24 -0400 X-Spook: broadside Cocaine Iran assassinate CESID event security X-Ran: nw\ZPV1..SY7nxd[cNQ9gTPpQ3`3fUW!f[V;c7PpM-M]L`E?0En%OeD"[~O>o!`B;VG\vu X-Hue: blue X-Attribution: GM In-Reply-To: <87ws5ij2rw.fsf@canonical.com> (Karl Fogel's message of "Wed, 05 Aug 2009 00:36:03 -0400") User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:113786 Archived-At: Karl Fogel wrote: > So, are we happy with debbugs? I'm not. Some of my reasons are listed here: http://emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?pkg=emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com The main problem is, it's effectively unmaintained, and the Emacs developers have no administrative access. A move to a gnu machine that would hopefully fix these issues has been waiting for the best part of a year. By the way, I have been tempted to suggest we just start using the gnu version anyway, rather than waiting for the current database to get moved there. > Here are problems that I've found discourage me from using debbugs: > > - Not really operable via the web -- just read-only operations. > This is huge. Not an issue for me. > - Does not do automatic duplicate-finding when a new bug is submitted. > Launchpad bugs does, and it's a real gift. What does "automatic duplicate-finding" mean? > (Actually, from reading the documentation, it's not clear to me how > to handle duplicates in debbugs at all -- there doesn't seem to be a > simple way to say "Close bug #Y because it's a duplicate of #X". As pointed out, the merge/forcemerge commands do this. > - A bit Debian-centric. See the long list of checkboxes for > distributions in the search form on the front page, for example. Offered to fix this kind of thing a year ago... (Bug#750) > Launchpad already has code for converting debbugs to Launchpad bugs, and > we could easily leave forwarding pointers. I don't think conversion > costs would be a huge problem, if we chose to convert. > > Thoughts? Questions I would ask of a bug tracker: How well maintained is it? How many developers are there, and how responsive are they to feature and problem requests? If we want to customize the way it behaves for Emacs, is there someone who can do this for us, or help us do it to our local copy if it's not a change appropriate for the tracker in general? Failing that, how easy is it for an outsider to modify the code? Can the Emacs developers get full administrative access? How does it handle spam? Unregistered users must be able to submit Emacs bug reports. Therefore there will be spam. Some kind of human moderation is required. Can this be integrated into the mail flow? The current emacsbugs method (closing spam bugs after the fact) is a waste of effort, and does not deal with spam added to existing bugs. The state of emacsbugs is shameful in this regard (again, see Bug#750 as an example). How does it handle the CC problem? Currently, when people report a new bug, they need to use X-Debbugs-CC rather than CC, lest each reply create a new bug. Often, they don't know they need to do this. Hence, bug 4065 and 4066, for example. Tracking of references/message-ids might fix this? If it sends out admin messages, can these be directed to a separate mail list from the normal bug list? Does it suppress duplicates? This may need message-id tracking. Can it automatically subscribe the bug reporter to all followup discussion? Does it obfuscate addresses in the web interface? How good is the search function? The debbugs one is not great. Your best bet is probably to just set up a test-bed for people to play with, and see if they like it...