* reconsider defaults custom group
@ 2002-12-25 18:19 Alex Schroeder
2002-12-26 1:22 ` Miles Bader
2002-12-26 23:39 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 2 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Alex Schroeder @ 2002-12-25 18:19 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: patware
Patrick Anderson posted a nice customization group for newbies on
http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ReconsiderDefaults
Was there not a thread a long time ago about building such a list?
Now at least we have a starting point.
Alex.
Here it is:
;;; reconsider-defaults.el --- reconsider default emacs settings.
;;; Commentary:
;; type
;; M-x eval-buffer RET
;; M-x reconsider-defaults RET
;; this will create a "customization" buffer used to make permanent changes to emacs behavior
;;; Code:
(defgroup reconsider-defaults nil
:group 'emacs)
(defun reconsider-defaults ()
"reconsider default emacs settings."
(interactive)
(mapcar (lambda (var)
(custom-add-to-group 'reconsider-defaults var 'custom-variable))
'(
confirm-kill-emacs
global-font-lock-mode
iswitchb-mode
auto-compression-mode
suggest-key-bindings
transient-mark-mode
dired-recursive-copies
dired-recursive-deletes
blink-cursor
x-stretch-cursor
show-paren-mode
show-trailing-whitespace
desktop-enable
display-time-mode
display-time-day-and-date
display-time-format
display-time-mode
hs-isearch-open
view-diary-entries-initially
apropos-do-all
winner-mode
tab-stop-list
tab-width
enable-recursive-minibuffers
woman-use-own-frame
blink-cursor-delay
blink-cursor-interval
blink-matching-paren-dont-ignore-comments
eol-mnemonic-mac
eol-mnemonic-undecided
eol-mnemonic-unix
archive-zip-use-pkzip
auto-save-list-file-prefix
user-full-name
user-mail-address
global-hl-line-mode
bookmark-bmenu-toggle-filenames
bookmark-sort-flag
browse-url-browser-function
c-default-style
c-echo-syntactic-information-p
c-mode-common-hook
case-fold-search
column-number-mode
completion-ignored-extensions
delete-selection-mode
diary-file
diary-hook
dired-at-point-require-prefix
ediff-diff-options
ediff-window-setup-function
emacs-lisp-mode-hook
emacs-wiki-downcase-title-words
emacs-wiki-highlight-markup
eshell-buffer-maximum-lines
eshell-cmpl-man-function
eshell-directory-name
eshell-force-execution
eshell-group-file
eshell-hosts-file
eshell-interpreter-alist
eshell-ls-archive-regexp
eshell-ls-dired-initial-args
eshell-ls-highlight-alist
eshell-ls-initial-args
eshell-ls-product-regexp
eshell-ls-use-in-dired
eshell-passwd-file
eshell-send-direct-to-subprocesses
flyspell-default-dictionary
font-lock-maximum-size
generic-define-unix-modes
gnus-asynchronous
gnus-default-directory
gnus-group-list-inactive-groups
gnus-home-directory
gnus-large-newsgroup
gnus-message-archive-group
gnus-use-cache
gnus-use-dribble-file
gud-cdb-directories
gud-chdir-before-run
hi-lock-mode
highlight-changes-active-string
highlight-changes-global-changes-existing-buffers
highlight-changes-passive-string
hippie-expand-try-functions-list ;(define-key global-map [(meta ?/)] 'hippie-expand)
htmlize-html-major-mode
isearch-lazy-highlight-cleanup
isearch-lazy-highlight-initial-delay
isearch-lazy-highlight-max-at-a-time
ls-lisp-emulation
ls-lisp-ignore-case
ls-lisp-verbosity
mail-host-address
mail-source-crash-box
mail-source-directory
mail-user-agent
make-backup-files
mark-diary-entries-in-calendar
mark-holidays-in-calendar
max-specpdl-size
message-directory
message-log-max
message-send-mail-function
mmm-global-mode
mmm-major-mode-preferences
mmm-mode-ext-classes-alist
mode-line-format
mouse-wheel-mode
next-line-add-newlines
next-screen-context-lines
nnmail-message-id-cache-file
parens-require-spaces
read-quoted-char-radix
resize-minibuffer-mode
scroll-bar-mode
scroll-preserve-screen-position
send-mail-function
shell-file-name
smtpmail-auth-credentials
smtpmail-debug-info
smtpmail-default-smtp-server
smtpmail-local-domain
smtpmail-queue-dir
smtpmail-smtp-server
tags-revert-without-query
tramp-debug-buffer
uniquify-buffer-name-style
url-cache-directory
url-cookie-file
url-global-history-file
url-global-history-save-interval
url-keep-history
vc-default-back-end
w3m-bookmark-file
w3m-default-save-directory
w3m-fill-column
w3m-key-binding
w3m-local-directory-view-method
w3m-search-default-engine
w3m-use-header-line
ange-ftp-dumb-unix-host-regexp
ange-ftp-generate-anonymous-password
appt-message-warning-time
))
(customize-group 'reconsider-defaults))
;;; reconsider-defaults.el ends here
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
2002-12-25 18:19 Alex Schroeder
@ 2002-12-26 1:22 ` Miles Bader
2002-12-26 23:39 ` Richard Stallman
1 sibling, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Miles Bader @ 2002-12-26 1:22 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: emacs-devel
How are all those particular variables related to each other? Why the
odd name (`Reconsider Defaults' sounds as if it's trying to give you a
2nd chance before you change something, which is a decidedly odd concept
in Customize, since it's a generally declarative interface!)?
-Miles
--
Occam's razor split hairs so well, I bought the whole argument!
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
2002-12-25 18:19 Alex Schroeder
2002-12-26 1:22 ` Miles Bader
@ 2002-12-26 23:39 ` Richard Stallman
2003-01-02 20:26 ` patware
1 sibling, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Richard Stallman @ 2002-12-26 23:39 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: emacs-devel
I think this is useful, but I agree that `reconsider-defaults' is a
strange and unnatural name for it. `basic' or `popular-options'
would be much better.
Do you think some of these options should have different defaults?
Would you like to propose 4 options to change the defauls of?
(If you told me a long list, I could not think about them all.)
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
2002-12-26 23:39 ` Richard Stallman
@ 2003-01-02 20:26 ` patware
2003-01-03 7:50 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: patware @ 2003-01-02 20:26 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: alex
> I think this is useful, but I agree that `reconsider-defaults' is a
> strange and unnatural name for it. `basic' or `popular-options' would
> be much better.
>
> Do you think some of these options should have different defaults? Would
> you like to propose 4 options to change the defauls of?
> (If you told me a long list, I could not think about them all.)
i care nothing about the name. the title reflects my relation to EMACS
development (outside of it). the meaning is/was "as a user i want to
reconsider this editors default values".
the list is available here
http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ReconsiderDefaults and is
(beginning to be) sorted by order of severity. severity means "variables
that the community considers incorrectly defaulted"
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
@ 2003-01-02 20:36 Patrick Anderson
2003-01-04 0:18 ` Kim F. Storm
0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Patrick Anderson @ 2003-01-02 20:36 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: alex
> I think this is useful, but I agree that `reconsider-defaults'' is a
> strange and unnatural name for it. `basic'' or `popular-options'' would
> be much better.
>
> Do you think some of these options should have different defaults? Would
> you like to propose 4 options to change the defauls of?
> (If you told me a long list, I could not think about them all.)
i care nothing about the name. the title reflects my relation to EMACS development (outside of it). the meaning is/was "as a user i want to reconsider this editor's default values".
the list is available here http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ReconsiderDefaults and is (beginning to be) sorted by order of severity. severity means "variables that the community considers incorrectly defaulted"
patrick
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
2003-01-02 20:26 ` patware
@ 2003-01-03 7:50 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Richard Stallman @ 2003-01-03 7:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: alex
If you think some of these options should have different defaults,
would you please mention 4 such options, and for each one explain why
you think it should be changed? I can consider a few such issues.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
@ 2003-01-03 23:45 Patrick Anderson
0 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Patrick Anderson @ 2003-01-03 23:45 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: alex
please see http://emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?PopularOptions for the most recent community-changed results.
-----Original Message-----
From: Kim F. Storm [mailto:no-spam@cua.dk]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 5:19 PM
To: Patrick Anderson
Cc: rms@gnu.org; alex@emacswiki.org; emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: reconsider defaults custom group
Patrick Anderson <panderson@altiris.com> writes:
> > I think this is useful, but I agree that `reconsider-defaults'' is a
> > strange and unnatural name for it. `basic'' or `popular-options'' would
> > be much better.
> >
> > Do you think some of these options should have different defaults? Would
> > you like to propose 4 options to change the defauls of?
> > (If you told me a long list, I could not think about them all.)
>
Below is the list copied from the URL above. It has this intro:
emacs can be difficult to use out of the box
this is mostly for those climbing the steep curve of this religion
please sort by severity
I personally agree that several of the listed options could have
better defaults for the novice (and expert) emacs user.
* confirm-kill-emacs
* global-font-lock-mode
* iswitchb-mode
* ido-mode (new in 21.4)
* cua-mode (new in 21.4)
* auto-compression-mode
* suggest-key-bindings
* transient-mark-mode
* dired-recursive-copies
* dired-recursive-deletes
* blink-cursor
* x-stretch-cursor
* show-paren-mode
* show-trailing-whitespace
* desktop-enable
* display-time-mode
* display-time-day-and-date
* display-time-format
* display-time-mode
* hs-isearch-open
* view-diary-entries-initially
* apropos-do-all
* winner-mode
* tab-stop-list
* tab-width
* enable-recursive-minibuffers
* woman-use-own-frame
* blink-cursor-delay
* blink-cursor-interval
* blink-matching-paren-dont-ignore-comments
* eol-mnemonic-mac
* eol-mnemonic-undecided
* eol-mnemonic-unix
* archive-zip-use-pkzip
* auto-save-list-file-prefix
* user-full-name
* user-mail-address
* global-hl-line-mode
* bookmark-bmenu-toggle-filenames
* bookmark-sort-flag
* browse-url-browser-function
* c-default-style
* c-echo-syntactic-information-p
* c-mode-common-hook
* case-fold-search
* column-number-mode
* completion-ignored-extensions
* delete-selection-mode
* diary-file
* diary-hook
* dired-at-point-require-prefix
* ediff-diff-options
* ediff-window-setup-function
* emacs-lisp-mode-hook
* emacs-wiki-downcase-title-words
* emacs-wiki-highlight-markup
* eshell-buffer-maximum-lines
* eshell-cmpl-man-function
* eshell-directory-name
* eshell-force-execution
* eshell-group-file
* eshell-hosts-file
* eshell-interpreter-alist
* eshell-ls-archive-regexp
* eshell-ls-dired-initial-args
* eshell-ls-highlight-alist
* eshell-ls-initial-args
* eshell-ls-product-regexp
* eshell-ls-use-in-dired
* eshell-passwd-file
* eshell-send-direct-to-subprocesses
* flyspell-default-dictionary
* font-lock-maximum-size
* generic-define-unix-modes
* gnus-asynchronous
* gnus-default-directory
* gnus-group-list-inactive-groups
* gnus-home-directory
* gnus-large-newsgroup
* gnus-message-archive-group
* gnus-use-cache
* gnus-use-dribble-file
* gud-cdb-directories
* gud-chdir-before-run
* hi-lock-mode
* highlight-changes-active-string
* highlight-changes-global-changes-existing-buffers
* highlight-changes-passive-string
* hippie-expand-try-functions-list ;(define-key global-map [(meta ?/)] 'hippie-expand)
* htmlize-html-major-mode
* isearch-lazy-highlight-cleanup
* isearch-lazy-highlight-initial-delay
* isearch-lazy-highlight-max-at-a-time
* ls-lisp-emulation
* ls-lisp-ignore-case
* ls-lisp-verbosity
* mail-host-address
* mail-source-crash-box
* mail-source-directory
* mail-user-agent
* make-backup-files
* mark-diary-entries-in-calendar
* mark-holidays-in-calendar
* max-specpdl-size
* message-directory
* message-log-max
* message-send-mail-function
* mmm-global-mode
* mmm-major-mode-preferences
* mmm-mode-ext-classes-alist
* mode-line-format
* mouse-wheel-mode
* next-line-add-newlines
* next-screen-context-lines
* nnmail-message-id-cache-file
* parens-require-spaces
* read-quoted-char-radix
* resize-minibuffer-mode
* scroll-bar-mode
* scroll-preserve-screen-position
* send-mail-function
* shell-file-name
* smtpmail-auth-credentials
* smtpmail-debug-info
* smtpmail-default-smtp-server
* smtpmail-local-domain
* smtpmail-queue-dir
* smtpmail-smtp-server
* tags-revert-without-query
* tramp-debug-buffer
* uniquify-buffer-name-style
* url-cache-directory
* url-cookie-file
* url-global-history-file
* url-global-history-save-interval
* url-keep-history
* vc-default-back-end
* w3m-bookmark-file
* w3m-default-save-directory
* w3m-fill-column
* w3m-key-binding
* w3m-local-directory-view-method
* w3m-search-default-engine
* w3m-use-header-line
* ange-ftp-dumb-unix-host-regexp
* ange-ftp-generate-anonymous-password
* appt-message-warning-time
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
2003-01-02 20:36 Patrick Anderson
@ 2003-01-04 0:18 ` Kim F. Storm
2003-01-04 23:44 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Kim F. Storm @ 2003-01-04 0:18 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: alex
Patrick Anderson <panderson@altiris.com> writes:
> > I think this is useful, but I agree that `reconsider-defaults'' is a
> > strange and unnatural name for it. `basic'' or `popular-options'' would
> > be much better.
> >
> > Do you think some of these options should have different defaults? Would
> > you like to propose 4 options to change the defauls of?
> > (If you told me a long list, I could not think about them all.)
>
Below is the list copied from the URL above. It has this intro:
emacs can be difficult to use out of the box
this is mostly for those climbing the steep curve of this religion
please sort by severity
I personally agree that several of the listed options could have
better defaults for the novice (and expert) emacs user.
* confirm-kill-emacs
* global-font-lock-mode
* iswitchb-mode
* ido-mode (new in 21.4)
* cua-mode (new in 21.4)
* auto-compression-mode
* suggest-key-bindings
* transient-mark-mode
* dired-recursive-copies
* dired-recursive-deletes
* blink-cursor
* x-stretch-cursor
* show-paren-mode
* show-trailing-whitespace
* desktop-enable
* display-time-mode
* display-time-day-and-date
* display-time-format
* display-time-mode
* hs-isearch-open
* view-diary-entries-initially
* apropos-do-all
* winner-mode
* tab-stop-list
* tab-width
* enable-recursive-minibuffers
* woman-use-own-frame
* blink-cursor-delay
* blink-cursor-interval
* blink-matching-paren-dont-ignore-comments
* eol-mnemonic-mac
* eol-mnemonic-undecided
* eol-mnemonic-unix
* archive-zip-use-pkzip
* auto-save-list-file-prefix
* user-full-name
* user-mail-address
* global-hl-line-mode
* bookmark-bmenu-toggle-filenames
* bookmark-sort-flag
* browse-url-browser-function
* c-default-style
* c-echo-syntactic-information-p
* c-mode-common-hook
* case-fold-search
* column-number-mode
* completion-ignored-extensions
* delete-selection-mode
* diary-file
* diary-hook
* dired-at-point-require-prefix
* ediff-diff-options
* ediff-window-setup-function
* emacs-lisp-mode-hook
* emacs-wiki-downcase-title-words
* emacs-wiki-highlight-markup
* eshell-buffer-maximum-lines
* eshell-cmpl-man-function
* eshell-directory-name
* eshell-force-execution
* eshell-group-file
* eshell-hosts-file
* eshell-interpreter-alist
* eshell-ls-archive-regexp
* eshell-ls-dired-initial-args
* eshell-ls-highlight-alist
* eshell-ls-initial-args
* eshell-ls-product-regexp
* eshell-ls-use-in-dired
* eshell-passwd-file
* eshell-send-direct-to-subprocesses
* flyspell-default-dictionary
* font-lock-maximum-size
* generic-define-unix-modes
* gnus-asynchronous
* gnus-default-directory
* gnus-group-list-inactive-groups
* gnus-home-directory
* gnus-large-newsgroup
* gnus-message-archive-group
* gnus-use-cache
* gnus-use-dribble-file
* gud-cdb-directories
* gud-chdir-before-run
* hi-lock-mode
* highlight-changes-active-string
* highlight-changes-global-changes-existing-buffers
* highlight-changes-passive-string
* hippie-expand-try-functions-list ;(define-key global-map [(meta ?/)] 'hippie-expand)
* htmlize-html-major-mode
* isearch-lazy-highlight-cleanup
* isearch-lazy-highlight-initial-delay
* isearch-lazy-highlight-max-at-a-time
* ls-lisp-emulation
* ls-lisp-ignore-case
* ls-lisp-verbosity
* mail-host-address
* mail-source-crash-box
* mail-source-directory
* mail-user-agent
* make-backup-files
* mark-diary-entries-in-calendar
* mark-holidays-in-calendar
* max-specpdl-size
* message-directory
* message-log-max
* message-send-mail-function
* mmm-global-mode
* mmm-major-mode-preferences
* mmm-mode-ext-classes-alist
* mode-line-format
* mouse-wheel-mode
* next-line-add-newlines
* next-screen-context-lines
* nnmail-message-id-cache-file
* parens-require-spaces
* read-quoted-char-radix
* resize-minibuffer-mode
* scroll-bar-mode
* scroll-preserve-screen-position
* send-mail-function
* shell-file-name
* smtpmail-auth-credentials
* smtpmail-debug-info
* smtpmail-default-smtp-server
* smtpmail-local-domain
* smtpmail-queue-dir
* smtpmail-smtp-server
* tags-revert-without-query
* tramp-debug-buffer
* uniquify-buffer-name-style
* url-cache-directory
* url-cookie-file
* url-global-history-file
* url-global-history-save-interval
* url-keep-history
* vc-default-back-end
* w3m-bookmark-file
* w3m-default-save-directory
* w3m-fill-column
* w3m-key-binding
* w3m-local-directory-view-method
* w3m-search-default-engine
* w3m-use-header-line
* ange-ftp-dumb-unix-host-regexp
* ange-ftp-generate-anonymous-password
* appt-message-warning-time
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
2003-01-04 0:18 ` Kim F. Storm
@ 2003-01-04 23:44 ` Richard Stallman
2003-01-05 4:03 ` Alex Schroeder
0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Richard Stallman @ 2003-01-04 23:44 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: alex
I personally agree that several of the listed options could have
better defaults for the novice (and expert) emacs user.
I cannot think about these changes en masse. Would you like to pick
just a few of them, and we can discuss them one by one?
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
2003-01-04 23:44 ` Richard Stallman
@ 2003-01-05 4:03 ` Alex Schroeder
2003-01-06 3:25 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Alex Schroeder @ 2003-01-05 4:03 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: emacs-devel
Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org> writes:
> I personally agree that several of the listed options could have
> better defaults for the novice (and expert) emacs user.
>
> I cannot think about these changes en masse. Would you like to pick
> just a few of them, and we can discuss them one by one?
Some of us are currently discussing a list of options on the wiki; we
will get back to you with a small number of defaults we suggest to
change, and a list of options we would like to put in a "newbies"
group (and hopefully with a good name for that group, too).
Alex.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
2003-01-05 4:03 ` Alex Schroeder
@ 2003-01-06 3:25 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Richard Stallman @ 2003-01-06 3:25 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: emacs-devel
Some of us are currently discussing a list of options on the wiki; we
will get back to you with a small number of defaults we suggest to
change,
Thanks. It's conceivable I might agree instantly with changing some
options, but more likely I'll want to see arguments in favor of it.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
@ 2003-01-06 16:30 Patrick Anderson
2003-01-06 20:50 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Patrick Anderson @ 2003-01-06 16:30 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: emacs-devel
to clarify:
i was never interested in actually changing the defaults. that may be useful for some of these, but was not my intention.
when it comes to default options the high-level goal for any product should be to satisfy the most people. but some options are chosen equally both directions. that means a default cannot be meaningfully chosen.
that is why i think popular-options.el should always be a part of the editor. a link from the welcome page could say something like "click to edit popularly changed options.". the displayed customization list should be sorted by those options which most equally split the community.
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Stallman [mailto:rms@gnu.org]
Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2003 8:25 PM
To: alex@emacswiki.org
Cc: kfs@cua.dk; Patrick Anderson; emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: reconsider defaults custom group
Some of us are currently discussing a list of options on the wiki; we
will get back to you with a small number of defaults we suggest to
change,
Thanks. It's conceivable I might agree instantly with changing some
options, but more likely I'll want to see arguments in favor of it.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: reconsider defaults custom group
2003-01-06 16:30 reconsider defaults custom group Patrick Anderson
@ 2003-01-06 20:50 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Richard Stallman @ 2003-01-06 20:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: alex
I agree that it's useful to have a "popular things to change" custom
group. Thanks for working on that, and I would be glad to install
a patch or a new file to set it up.
At the same time, if people want to argue for changing a few specific
options' defaults, I am interested in thinking about it.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2003-01-06 20:50 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 13+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2003-01-06 16:30 reconsider defaults custom group Patrick Anderson
2003-01-06 20:50 ` Richard Stallman
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2003-01-03 23:45 Patrick Anderson
2003-01-02 20:36 Patrick Anderson
2003-01-04 0:18 ` Kim F. Storm
2003-01-04 23:44 ` Richard Stallman
2003-01-05 4:03 ` Alex Schroeder
2003-01-06 3:25 ` Richard Stallman
2002-12-25 18:19 Alex Schroeder
2002-12-26 1:22 ` Miles Bader
2002-12-26 23:39 ` Richard Stallman
2003-01-02 20:26 ` patware
2003-01-03 7:50 ` Richard Stallman
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