Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Torben Knudsen]

Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

I try to set the size of emacs by putting 

emacs.geometry:80x64+1440

in .Xresources

Then I get emacs windows with size 80x59.  I can make the size smaller
but not larger.  How can I fix this?

-- 
Associate Prof. Ph.D Torben Knudsen	Mobile	: (+45) 2787 9826
Section of Automation and Control,	Direct	: 6 8694
Department of Electronic Systems,	Email	: tk@es.aau.dk   
Aalborg University 
Fredrik Bajersvej 7 
DK-9220 Aalborg Ø
Denmark 

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Peter Dyballa]

Am 08.10.2008 um 10:32 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

> emacs.geometry:80x64+1440


This does not look correct: where is the y offset?

--
Greetings

   Pete

Globalisation – communism from above.

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Torben Knudsen]

>>>>> "Peter" == Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:

Peter> Am 08.10.2008 um 10:32 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

>> emacs.geometry:80x64+1440


Peter> This does not look correct: where is the y offset?

You don't need an y offset.  I tried the below with the same result
namely size 80x59
tk@tk-laptop:~$ emacs -g 80x84+1440
tk@tk-laptop:~$ emacs -g 80x84+1440+0

-- 
Associate Prof. Ph.D Torben Knudsen	Mobile	: (+45) 2787 9826
Section of Automation and Control,	Direct	: 6 8694
Department of Electronic Systems,	Email	: tk@es.aau.dk   
Aalborg University 
Fredrik Bajersvej 7 
DK-9220 Aalborg Ø
Denmark 

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Peter Dyballa]

Am 08.10.2008 um 11:23 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

> You don't need an y offset.  I tried the below with the same result


Then you seem to have found some bug! Could be it's in your window  
manager ...

BTW, I am using

	Emacs*geometry: 97x53+111+11

and I also set initial-frame-alist and default-frame-alist. With  
Apple's quartz-wm, launched as proxy to be able to connect to the  
Aqua world, and Blackbox as window manager I can change geometry  
arbitrarily. For example:

   Corners:  +463+14  -195+14  -195-15  +463-15
   -geometry 124x76+461-7

Maybe you have set an unchangeable/fixed/immutable lock ... or such!  
Could be xwininfo can give a hint. Or Gconf.

--
Greetings

   Pete

                   Sorry my terrible English, my native language Lisp!

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Torben Knudsen]

>>>>> "Peter" == Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:

Peter> Am 08.10.2008 um 11:23 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

>> You don't need an y offset.  I tried the below with the same result


Peter> Then you seem to have found some bug! Could be it's in your
Peter> window manager ...

Then I will give up and wait for updates

Peter> BTW, I am using

Peter> 	Emacs*geometry: 97x53+111+11

Peter> and I also set initial-frame-alist and
Peter> default-frame-alist. With Apple's quartz-wm, launched as proxy
Peter> to be able to connect to the Aqua world, and Blackbox as window
Peter> manager I can change geometry arbitrarily. For example:

Peter>   Corners: +463+14 -195+14 -195-15 +463-15 -geometry
Peter> 124x76+461-7

Peter> Maybe you have set an unchangeable/fixed/immutable lock ... or
Peter> such!  Could be xwininfo can give a hint. Or Gconf.

xwininfo gave the following which does not tell me much

tk@tk-laptop:~$ emacs -g 80x84+1440+0&
[4] 26993
tk@tk-laptop:~$ xwininfo

xwininfo: Please select the window about which you
          would like information by clicking the
          mouse in that window.

xwininfo: Window id: 0x36000a5 "*scratch* - Emacs"

  Absolute upper-left X:  1445
  Absolute upper-left Y:  24
  Relative upper-left X:  5
  Relative upper-left Y:  24
  Width: 820
  Height: 910
  Depth: 24
  Visual Class: TrueColor
  Border width: 0
  Class: InputOutput
  Colormap: 0x20 (installed)
  Bit Gravity State: NorthWestGravity
  Window Gravity State: NorthWestGravity
  Backing Store State: NotUseful
  Save Under State: no
  Map State: IsViewable
  Override Redirect State: no
  Corners:  +1445+24  -455+24  -455-90  +1445-90
  -geometry 80x59+1440+0

tk@tk-laptop:~$ 


-- 
Associate Prof. Ph.D Torben Knudsen	Mobile	: (+45) 2787 9826
Section of Automation and Control,	Direct	: 6 8694
Department of Electronic Systems,	Email	: tk@es.aau.dk   
Aalborg University 
Fredrik Bajersvej 7 
DK-9220 Aalborg Ø
Denmark 

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Peter Dyballa]

Am 08.10.2008 um 12:18 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

> xwininfo: Window id: 0x36000a5 "*scratch* - Emacs"

The outpur looks OK.

You could experiment with initial-frame-alist and default-frame- 
alist. Geometry settings when evaluated in *scratch* buffer apply,  
and overwrite X resources. Just an example:

	(setq initial-frame-alist '(
	  (mouse-color		 . "midnightblue")
	  (foreground-color	 . "grey20")
	  (background-color	 . "alice blue")
	  (internal-border-width . 2)
	  (line-spacing		 . 1)
	  (active-alpha		 . 0.875)
	  (inactive-alpha	 . 0.75)
	  (top . 25) (left . 650) (width . 91) (height . 50)))

BTW, how do you try to change the size of GNU Emacs' frame? Have  
tried to create a second frame (C-x 5 2)? And how do you change your  
X resources?

--
Greetings

   Pete

If it should exist, it doesn't.
				– Arnold's First Law of Documentation

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Torben Knudsen]

>>>>> "Peter" == Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:

Peter> Am 08.10.2008 um 12:18 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

>> xwininfo: Window id: 0x36000a5 "*scratch* - Emacs"

Peter> The outpur looks OK.

Peter> You could experiment with initial-frame-alist and
Peter> default-frame- alist. Geometry settings when evaluated in
Peter> *scratch* buffer apply, and overwrite X resources. Just an
Peter> example:

Peter> 	(setq initial-frame-alist '( (mouse-color . "midnightblue")
Peter> (foreground-color . "grey20") (background-color . "alice blue")
Peter> (internal-border-width . 2) (line-spacing . 1) (active-alpha
Peter> . 0.875) (inactive-alpha . 0.75) (top . 25) (left . 650) (width
Peter> . 91) (height . 50)))

In .Xresources

emacs.geometry:80x64+1440

In .emacs

(setq default-frame-alist '((width . 80) (height . 64)))
(setq initial-frame-alist '((top . 1) (left . 1) (width . 80) (height . 64)))

After startup of emacs these values are:

initial-frame-alist is a variable defined in `frame.el'.
Its value is 
((top . 1)
 (left . 1)
 (width . 80)
 (height . 64))

default-frame-alist is a variable defined in `C source code'.
Its value is 
((menu-bar-lines . 1)
 (tool-bar-lines . 0)
 (vertical-scroll-bars)
 (width . 80)
 (height . 64))

Still the window is 80 x 59

Peter> BTW, how do you try to change the size of GNU Emacs' frame?
Peter> Have tried to create a second frame (C-x 5 2)? And how do you
Peter> change your X resources?

C-x 5 2 Gives a frame of size 80 x 53

I use .Xresources

-- 
Associate Prof. Ph.D Torben Knudsen	Mobile	: (+45) 2787 9826
Section of Automation and Control,	Direct	: 6 8694
Department of Electronic Systems,	Email	: tk@es.aau.dk   
Aalborg University 
Fredrik Bajersvej 7 
DK-9220 Aalborg Ø
Denmark 

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Peter Dyballa]

Am 10.10.2008 um 08:49 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

> initial-frame-alist is a variable defined in `frame.el'.
> Its value is
> ((top . 1)
>  (left . 1)
>  (width . 80)
>  (height . 64))
>
> default-frame-alist is a variable defined in `C source code'.
> Its value is
> ((menu-bar-lines . 1)
>  (tool-bar-lines . 0)
>  (vertical-scroll-bars)
>  (width . 80)
>  (height . 64))
>
> Still the window is 80 x 59


How do you measure? Do you count mode-lines, echo-area/minibuffer?  
And window decoration? The lines times columns area is inside the  
window decoration from the window manager. When you switch to a  
larger or smaller font the frame (X window) changes its size. When  
you use (in TeX or info buffers or in mode-line) fonts with a  
different size the size of the frame or (GNU Emacs) window does not  
change.

--
Greetings

   Pete

There's something the technicians need to learn from the artists. If  
it isn't aesthetically pleasing, it's probably wrong.

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Torben Knudsen]

>>>>> "Peter" == Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:

Peter> Am 10.10.2008 um 08:49 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

>> initial-frame-alist is a variable defined in `frame.el'.  Its value
>> is ((top . 1) (left . 1) (width . 80) (height . 64))
>> 
>> default-frame-alist is a variable defined in `C source code'.  Its
>> value is ((menu-bar-lines . 1) (tool-bar-lines . 0)
>> (vertical-scroll-bars) (width . 80) (height . 64))
>> 
>> Still the window is 80 x 59


Peter> How do you measure? Do you count mode-lines,
Peter> echo-area/minibuffer?  And window decoration? The lines times
Peter> columns area is inside the window decoration from the window
Peter> manager. When you switch to a larger or smaller font the frame
Peter> (X window) changes its size. When you use (in TeX or info
Peter> buffers or in mode-line) fonts with a different size the size
Peter> of the frame or (GNU Emacs) window does not change.

I place the mouse pointer in the lower right corner and a small box
pops up and says 80x59 also if I change to e.g. (height . 34) the
result is still the same.

-- 
Associate Prof. Ph.D Torben Knudsen	Mobile	: (+45) 2787 9826
Section of Automation and Control,	Direct	: 6 8694
Department of Electronic Systems,	Email	: tk@es.aau.dk   
Aalborg University 
Fredrik Bajersvej 7 
DK-9220 Aalborg Ø
Denmark 

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Peter Dyballa]

Am 10.10.2008 um 13:14 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

>>> default-frame-alist is a variable defined in `C source code'.  Its
>>> value is ((menu-bar-lines . 1) (tool-bar-lines . 0)
>>> (vertical-scroll-bars) (width . 80) (height . 64))
>>>
>>> Still the window is 80 x 59

For me the (X) window or GNU Emacs frame size does not change  
instantaneously when I change default-frame-alist – but a new frame  
(C-x 5 2) obeys the new values! Does this work for you?

--
Greetings

   Pete

Real Time, adj.:
	Here and now, as opposed to fake time, which only occurs there and  
then.

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Torben Knudsen]

>>>>> "Peter" == Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:

Peter> Am 10.10.2008 um 13:14 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

>>>> default-frame-alist is a variable defined in `C source code'.
>>>> Its value is ((menu-bar-lines . 1) (tool-bar-lines . 0)
>>>> (vertical-scroll-bars) (width . 80) (height . 64))
>>>> 
>>>> Still the window is 80 x 59

Peter> For me the (X) window or GNU Emacs frame size does not change
Peter> instantaneously when I change default-frame-alist – but a new
Peter> frame (C-x 5 2) obeys the new values! Does this work for you?

Inspired by you question I think I learned something at least.

I have a two screen solution where my lap top is left and a external
screen is right it starts from 1440.

1. If I have my current emacs in the right screen and do 
(setq default-frame-alist '((width . 80) (height . 64)))
a new frame opens in the right screen but width size 80 x 50.  

2. If I do
(setq default-frame-alist '((top . 0) (left . 0) (width . 80) (height . 64)))
I get a frame in the left screen size 80 x 50.

Now 80 x 50 is the maximum size in the left window which I get there
with height >= 50.

3. If instead I do
(setq default-frame-alist '((top . 0) (left . 1440) (width . 80) (height . 64)))
the frame opens in the right window with the right size.

So it seems that if my current emacs is in the right screen a new
frame opens there but limited to the max size according to the screen
at left i.e.  (top . 0) (left . 0).

Now I think my problem is solved.  I don't now if you are satisfied.
Thanks for all the help.

-- 
Associate Prof. Ph.D Torben Knudsen	Mobile	: (+45) 2787 9826
Section of Automation and Control,	Direct	: 6 8694
Department of Electronic Systems,	Email	: tk@es.aau.dk   
Aalborg University 
Fredrik Bajersvej 7 
DK-9220 Aalborg Ø
Denmark 

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Peter Dyballa]

Am 13.10.2008 um 08:33 schrieb Torben Knudsen:

> Now I think my problem is solved.  I don't now if you are satisfied.


I am! You have a learning success and are happy now, GNU Emacs does  
not have another bug – at least it seems that it does not take into  
account different screen sizes when trying to avoid creating a frame  
that extends the display's size. It might be worth to report this  
behaviour in a bug report ...

--
Greetings

   Pete

To be is to do.
			– I. Kant
To do is to be.
			– A. Sartre
Yabba-Dabba-Doo!
			– F. Flintstone

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Chetan]

Torben Knudsen <tk@es.aau.dk> writes:

>>>>>> "Peter" == Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:
>
> Peter> Am 08.10.2008 um 11:23 schrieb Torben Knudsen:
>
>>> You don't need an y offset.  I tried the below with the same result
>
>
> Peter> Then you seem to have found some bug! Could be it's in your
> Peter> window manager ...
>
> Then I will give up and wait for updates
>
> Peter> BTW, I am using
>
> Peter> 	Emacs*geometry: 97x53+111+11
>
> Peter> and I also set initial-frame-alist and
> Peter> default-frame-alist. With Apple's quartz-wm, launched as proxy
> Peter> to be able to connect to the Aqua world, and Blackbox as window
> Peter> manager I can change geometry arbitrarily. For example:
>
> Peter>   Corners: +463+14 -195+14 -195-15 +463-15 -geometry
> Peter> 124x76+461-7
>
> Peter> Maybe you have set an unchangeable/fixed/immutable lock ... or
> Peter> such!  Could be xwininfo can give a hint. Or Gconf.
>
> xwininfo gave the following which does not tell me much
>
> tk@tk-laptop:~$ emacs -g 80x84+1440+0&
> [4] 26993
> tk@tk-laptop:~$ xwininfo
>
> xwininfo: Please select the window about which you
>           would like information by clicking the
>           mouse in that window.
>
> xwininfo: Window id: 0x36000a5 "*scratch* - Emacs"
>
>   Absolute upper-left X:  1445
>   Absolute upper-left Y:  24
>   Relative upper-left X:  5
>   Relative upper-left Y:  24
>   Width: 820
>   Height: 910
>   Depth: 24
>   Visual Class: TrueColor
>   Border width: 0
>   Class: InputOutput
>   Colormap: 0x20 (installed)
>   Bit Gravity State: NorthWestGravity
>   Window Gravity State: NorthWestGravity
>   Backing Store State: NotUseful
>   Save Under State: no
>   Map State: IsViewable
>   Override Redirect State: no
>   Corners:  +1445+24  -455+24  -455-90  +1445-90
>   -geometry 80x59+1440+0
>
> tk@tk-laptop:~$ 

I don't have problem with the size, but with the initial y position.
runemacs -g 120x64+300+200
Always at the top edge. I don't see that with 21.3.
I don't set initial-frame-alist.

Chetan

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Peter Dyballa]

Am 08.10.2008 um 17:59 schrieb Chetan:

> I don't set initial-frame-alist.


What is the value of your default-frame-alist?

--
Greetings

   Pete

The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds new  
discoveries, is not "Eureka!" (I found it!) but "That's funny..."
				– Isaac Asimov

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Chetan]

Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:

> Am 08.10.2008 um 17:59 schrieb Chetan:
>
>> I don't set initial-frame-alist.
>
>
> What is the value of your default-frame-alist?
>
> --
> Greetings
>
>   Pete
>
> The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds new
> discoveries, is not "Eureka!" (I found it!) but "That's funny..."
> 				– Isaac Asimov
Value: 
((width . 120)
 (height . 64)
 (user-size . t)
 (left-fringe)
 (right-fringe)
 (menu-bar-lines . 0)
 (tool-bar-lines . 0)
 (vertical-scroll-bars)
 (font . "-*-Lucida Console-normal-r-*-*-11-82-*-*-c-*-*-ansi-")
 (foreground-color . "wheat")
 (background-color . "darkslategrey")
 (mouse-color . "Grey")
 (cursor-color . "LightGray")
 (border-color . "Black")
 (background-mode . dark))

However, I tried some more and found something else. Apparantly it
works as expected when I invoke from the cmd prompt. I have a launcher
program where I launch emacs from. Apparantly this happens only when
invoked by the launcher. But the funny thing is that 21.3 when invoked
by the same program behaves as expected.

Looks like I have ghosts to exorcise.

Chetan

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Peter Dyballa]

Am 08.10.2008 um 20:50 schrieb Chetan:

> Value:
> ((width . 120)
>  (height . 64)


So you see the reason why GNU Emacs 22.x is always in "pole  
position." I think GNU Emacs 21.3 was not using *-frame-alist, so it  
follows the geometry as specified on invocation.

To cure your GNU Emacs 22.x problem:

     (setq default-frame-alist
       (append (list
	(top . 200) (left . 300)
	) default-frame-alist))


--
Greetings

   Pete

I hope to die before I *have* to use Microsoft Word.
			- Donald E. Knuth, 2001-10-02 in Tübingen.

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Chetan]

Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:

> Am 08.10.2008 um 20:50 schrieb Chetan:
>
>> Value:
>> ((width . 120)
>>  (height . 64)
>
>
> So you see the reason why GNU Emacs 22.x is always in "pole  position." I think
> GNU Emacs 21.3 was not using *-frame-alist, so it  follows the geometry as
> specified on invocation.
>
> To cure your GNU Emacs 22.x problem:
>
>     (setq default-frame-alist
>       (append (list
> 	(top . 200) (left . 300)
> 	) default-frame-alist))
>
>
> --
> Greetings
>
>   Pete
>
> I hope to die before I *have* to use Microsoft Word.
> 			- Donald E. Knuth, 2001-10-02 in Tübingen.

Thanks for the suggestion. It does seem to fix one problem, but creates
another. I like the default positioning provided for new frames. I
don't  want to make all frames show up on top of each other.

I don't see the reason why this should happen. It seems to respect the
'left' value but not 'top'. 

I do not set anything in the default-frame-alist except for the font.
The alist is initialized the way it is because of other functions I
call. The width and height are the values coming from the command
line. 

I only mentioned it because somebody else had a similar problem.

I checked the NEWS file after I found this, but it seems to say that
the position values are used for the initial frame.

At first I thought it was a bug, but since it works from shell, there
is something else at play.

Chetan

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Peter Dyballa]

Am 09.10.2008 um 01:20 schrieb Chetan:

> I do not set anything in the default-frame-alist except for the font.
> The alist is initialized the way it is because of other functions I
> call. The width and height are the values coming from the command
> line.

The latter sounds very reasonable: why use some special code to give  
GNU Emacs the desired frame size and position when there are the *- 
frame-alists?

>
> I checked the NEWS file after I found this, but it seems to say that
> the position values are used for the initial frame.

If there are *no* particular initial-frame-alist settings, then the  
default-frame-alist settings (also) apply for the first or initial  
frame.

>
> At first I thought it was a bug, but since it works from shell, there
> is something else at play.

Launching GNU Emacs with -Q (i.e. not loading system and user init  
files) allows you to examine the problem – and find and describe a  
possible bug. But beware: in windowing systems' environments there  
can be settings in (X11) resource or (MS) registry files that impose  
on their clients some behaviour (position, size) when nothing else is  
given ...

--
Greetings

   Pete
               <\
                 \__     O                       __O
                 | O\   _\\/\-%                _`\<,
                 '()-'-(_)--(_)               (_)/(_)

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Chetan]

Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:

> Am 09.10.2008 um 01:20 schrieb Chetan:
>
>> I do not set anything in the default-frame-alist except for the font.
>> The alist is initialized the way it is because of other functions I
>> call. The width and height are the values coming from the command
>> line.
>
> The latter sounds very reasonable: why use some special code to give  GNU Emacs
> the desired frame size and position when there are the *- 
> frame-alists?
>
There are limitations to fixing positions in .emacs. I would much
rather do it on the command line as required, especially when I use
the same .emacs on different machines.

>
>> I checked the NEWS file after I found this, but it seems to say that
>> the position values are used for the initial frame.
>
> If there are *no* particular initial-frame-alist settings, then the
> default-frame-alist settings (also) apply for the first or initial  frame.

This isn't about initial-frame-alist. It is about the command line
option not working, when there is no *-frame-alist to interfere.

>> At first I thought it was a bug, but since it works from shell, there
>> is something else at play.
>
> Launching GNU Emacs with -Q (i.e. not loading system and user init  files)
> allows you to examine the problem – and find and describe a  possible bug. But
> beware: in windowing systems' environments there  can be settings in (X11)
> resource or (MS) registry files that impose  on their clients some behaviour
> (position, size) when nothing else is  given ...

If the same environment works in other cases, there are other things
at play.

> --
> Greetings
>
>   Pete
>               <\
>                 \__     O                       __O
>                 | O\   _\\/\-%                _`\<,
>                 '()-'-(_)--(_)               (_)/(_)

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Tim X]

Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:

> Am 09.10.2008 um 01:20 schrieb Chetan:
>
>> I do not set anything in the default-frame-alist except for the font.
>> The alist is initialized the way it is because of other functions I
>> call. The width and height are the values coming from the command
>> line.
>
> The latter sounds very reasonable: why use some special code to give GNU
> Emacs the desired frame size and position when there are the *- 
> frame-alists?
>
>>
>> I checked the NEWS file after I found this, but it seems to say that
>> the position values are used for the initial frame.
>
> If there are *no* particular initial-frame-alist settings, then the
> default-frame-alist settings (also) apply for the first or initial  frame.
>
>>
>> At first I thought it was a bug, but since it works from shell, there
>> is something else at play.
>
> Launching GNU Emacs with -Q (i.e. not loading system and user init files)
> allows you to examine the problem – and find and describe a  possible
> bug. But beware: in windowing systems' environments there  can be settings
> in (X11) resource or (MS) registry files that impose  on their clients some
> behaviour (position, size) when nothing else is  given ...
>

this is particularly true of certain window managers under X. For
example, I have heard of others with problems regarding setting of
colours, position and size with KDE. This was some time ago and KDE has
gone under considerable changes, but I'd certainly be looking under KDE
settings if you are finding that Xresources and/or command line geometry
settings don't appear to be working as expected and you are using KDE as
your wm. Same goes for some key bindings - people often struggle trying
to work out why emacs key bindings are not working only to find that the
key event is being stolen by the window manager.

Tim

-- 
tcross (at) rapttech dot com dot au

Re: Size of emacs window can't exceed 59 in height

[Chetan]

Tim X <timx@nospam.dev.null> writes:

> Peter Dyballa <Peter_Dyballa@Web.DE> writes:
>
>> Am 09.10.2008 um 01:20 schrieb Chetan:
>>
>>> I do not set anything in the default-frame-alist except for the font.
>>> The alist is initialized the way it is because of other functions I
>>> call. The width and height are the values coming from the command
>>> line.
>>
>> The latter sounds very reasonable: why use some special code to give GNU
>> Emacs the desired frame size and position when there are the *- 
>> frame-alists?
>>
>>>
>>> I checked the NEWS file after I found this, but it seems to say that
>>> the position values are used for the initial frame.
>>
>> If there are *no* particular initial-frame-alist settings, then the
>> default-frame-alist settings (also) apply for the first or initial  frame.
>>
>>>
>>> At first I thought it was a bug, but since it works from shell, there
>>> is something else at play.
>>
>> Launching GNU Emacs with -Q (i.e. not loading system and user init files)
>> allows you to examine the problem – and find and describe a  possible
>> bug. But beware: in windowing systems' environments there  can be settings
>> in (X11) resource or (MS) registry files that impose  on their clients some
>> behaviour (position, size) when nothing else is  given ...
>>
>
> this is particularly true of certain window managers under X. For
> example, I have heard of others with problems regarding setting of
> colours, position and size with KDE. This was some time ago and KDE has
> gone under considerable changes, but I'd certainly be looking under KDE
> settings if you are finding that Xresources and/or command line geometry
> settings don't appear to be working as expected and you are using KDE as
> your wm. Same goes for some key bindings - people often struggle trying
> to work out why emacs key bindings are not working only to find that the
> key event is being stolen by the window manager.
>
> Tim

Yes, so many possibilities for things to get screwed up.

Chetan