* bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
2021-06-01 20:46 ` Basil L. Contovounesios
@ 2021-06-01 21:00 ` jaime.escalante
2021-06-01 22:50 ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-06-01 21:04 ` jaime.escalante
2021-06-01 21:31 ` bug#48764: [External] : " Drew Adams
2 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: jaime.escalante @ 2021-06-01 21:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Basil L. Contovounesios; +Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen, 48764
> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 at 8:46 AM
> From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@tcd.ie>
> To: jaime.escalante@gmx.com
> Cc: "Lars Ingebrigtsen" <larsi@gnus.org>, 48764@debbugs.gnu.org
> Subject: Re: bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
>
> jaime.escalante@gmx.com writes:
>
> > How about mini-buffer entries that require user writing a string. How would
> > a user figure out what to do?
> >
> > Is there any information about basic navigation keys for mini-buffer input in the manual?
>
> Does the node (info "(emacs) Minibuffer History")[1] in the Emacs manual
> count? FWIW, it can be found through index entries such as 'minibuffer
> history', 'M-n (minibuffer history)', 'DOWN (minibuffer history)', etc.
I would like to see some indication of the type of input it requires.
Perhaps that information can go on the mode-line (for instance some type
of designated coloured mouse button for mini-buffer information).
> For more details on minibuffer keymaps there's also
> (info "(emacs) Minibuffer Maps")[2], found e.g. via the index entry
> 'C-h r i minibuffer key TAB RET'.
>
> [1]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-History.html
> [2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-Maps.html
>
> HTH,
>
> --
> Basil
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
2021-06-01 21:00 ` jaime.escalante
@ 2021-06-01 22:50 ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-06-01 23:00 ` jaime.escalante
0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Basil L. Contovounesios @ 2021-06-01 22:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: jaime.escalante; +Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen, 48764
jaime.escalante@gmx.com writes:
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 at 8:46 AM
>> From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@tcd.ie>
>> To: jaime.escalante@gmx.com
>> Cc: "Lars Ingebrigtsen" <larsi@gnus.org>, 48764@debbugs.gnu.org
>> Subject: Re: bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
>>
>> jaime.escalante@gmx.com writes:
>>
>> > How about mini-buffer entries that require user writing a string. How would
>> > a user figure out what to do?
>> >
>> > Is there any information about basic navigation keys for mini-buffer input in the manual?
>>
>> Does the node (info "(emacs) Minibuffer History")[1] in the Emacs manual
>> count? FWIW, it can be found through index entries such as 'minibuffer
>> history', 'M-n (minibuffer history)', 'DOWN (minibuffer history)', etc.
>
> I would like to see some indication of the type of input it requires.
How does the type of input it requires differ from the type of input
required in any other Emacs buffer?
> Perhaps that information can go on the mode-line (for instance some type
> of designated coloured mouse button for mini-buffer information).
>
>> For more details on minibuffer keymaps there's also
>> (info "(emacs) Minibuffer Maps")[2], found e.g. via the index entry
>> 'C-h r i minibuffer key TAB RET'.
>>
>> [1]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-History.html
>> [2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-Maps.html
>>
>> HTH,
--
Basil
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
2021-06-01 22:50 ` Basil L. Contovounesios
@ 2021-06-01 23:00 ` jaime.escalante
0 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: jaime.escalante @ 2021-06-01 23:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Basil L. Contovounesios; +Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen, 48764
> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 at 10:50 AM
> From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@tcd.ie>
> To: jaime.escalante@gmx.com
> Cc: "Lars Ingebrigtsen" <larsi@gnus.org>, 48764@debbugs.gnu.org
> Subject: Re: bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
>
> jaime.escalante@gmx.com writes:
>
> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 at 8:46 AM
> >> From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@tcd.ie>
> >> To: jaime.escalante@gmx.com
> >> Cc: "Lars Ingebrigtsen" <larsi@gnus.org>, 48764@debbugs.gnu.org
> >> Subject: Re: bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
> >>
> >> jaime.escalante@gmx.com writes:
> >>
> >> > How about mini-buffer entries that require user writing a string. How would
> >> > a user figure out what to do?
> >> >
> >> > Is there any information about basic navigation keys for mini-buffer input in the manual?
> >>
> >> Does the node (info "(emacs) Minibuffer History")[1] in the Emacs manual
> >> count? FWIW, it can be found through index entries such as 'minibuffer
> >> history', 'M-n (minibuffer history)', 'DOWN (minibuffer history)', etc.
> >
> > I would like to see some indication of the type of input it requires.
>
> How does the type of input it requires differ from the type of input
> required in any other Emacs buffer?
It seems to me that you got to know exactly what to do, and I tend to forget
when I do not use a feature for some time.
> > Perhaps that information can go on the mode-line (for instance some type
> > of designated coloured mouse button for mini-buffer information).
> >
> >> For more details on minibuffer keymaps there's also
> >> (info "(emacs) Minibuffer Maps")[2], found e.g. via the index entry
> >> 'C-h r i minibuffer key TAB RET'.
> >>
> >> [1]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-History.html
> >> [2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-Maps.html
> >>
> >> HTH,
>
> --
> Basil
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
2021-06-01 20:46 ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-06-01 21:00 ` jaime.escalante
@ 2021-06-01 21:04 ` jaime.escalante
2021-06-01 22:50 ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-06-01 21:31 ` bug#48764: [External] : " Drew Adams
2 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: jaime.escalante @ 2021-06-01 21:04 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Basil L. Contovounesios; +Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen, 48764
> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 at 8:46 AM
> From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@tcd.ie>
> To: jaime.escalante@gmx.com
> Cc: "Lars Ingebrigtsen" <larsi@gnus.org>, 48764@debbugs.gnu.org
> Subject: bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
>
> jaime.escalante@gmx.com writes:
>
> > How about mini-buffer entries that require user writing a string. How would
> > a user figure out what to do?
> >
> > Is there any information about basic navigation keys for mini-buffer input in the manual?
>
> Does the node (info "(emacs) Minibuffer History")[1] in the Emacs manual
> count? FWIW, it can be found through index entries such as 'minibuffer
> history', 'M-n (minibuffer history)', 'DOWN (minibuffer history)', etc.
We are not really talking about mini-buffer history, but mini-buffer input.
> For more details on minibuffer keymaps there's also
> (info "(emacs) Minibuffer Maps")[2], found e.g. via the index entry
> 'C-h r i minibuffer key TAB RET'.
>
> [1]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-History.html
> [2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-Maps.html
>
> HTH,
>
> --
> Basil
>
>
>
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
2021-06-01 21:04 ` jaime.escalante
@ 2021-06-01 22:50 ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-06-01 23:04 ` jaime.escalante
0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Basil L. Contovounesios @ 2021-06-01 22:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: jaime.escalante; +Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen, 48764
jaime.escalante@gmx.com writes:
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 at 8:46 AM
>> From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@tcd.ie>
>> To: jaime.escalante@gmx.com
>> Cc: "Lars Ingebrigtsen" <larsi@gnus.org>, 48764@debbugs.gnu.org
>> Subject: bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
>>
>> jaime.escalante@gmx.com writes:
>>
>> > How about mini-buffer entries that require user writing a string. How would
>> > a user figure out what to do?
>> >
>> > Is there any information about basic navigation keys for mini-buffer input in the manual?
>>
>> Does the node (info "(emacs) Minibuffer History")[1] in the Emacs manual
>> count? FWIW, it can be found through index entries such as 'minibuffer
>> history', 'M-n (minibuffer history)', 'DOWN (minibuffer history)', etc.
>
> We are not really talking about mini-buffer history, but mini-buffer input.
The OP refers to <up> and <down>. In the minibuffer, these keys by
default navigate so-called "minibuffer history", where e.g. <down>
inserts "future" history, AKA the next default value. So <down> is
actually "navigating" the list of defaults (completing-read's 7th
argument), not the list of completions (completing-read's 2nd argument).
If this is not the kind of input you're referring to, then could you
please clarify which input you're referring to?
>> For more details on minibuffer keymaps there's also
>> (info "(emacs) Minibuffer Maps")[2], found e.g. via the index entry
>> 'C-h r i minibuffer key TAB RET'.
>>
>> [1]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-History.html
>> [2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-Maps.html
>>
>> HTH,
--
Basil
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
2021-06-01 22:50 ` Basil L. Contovounesios
@ 2021-06-01 23:04 ` jaime.escalante
0 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: jaime.escalante @ 2021-06-01 23:04 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Basil L. Contovounesios; +Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen, 48764
> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 at 10:50 AM
> From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@tcd.ie>
> To: jaime.escalante@gmx.com
> Cc: "Lars Ingebrigtsen" <larsi@gnus.org>, 48764@debbugs.gnu.org
> Subject: Re: bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
>
> jaime.escalante@gmx.com writes:
>
> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 at 8:46 AM
> >> From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@tcd.ie>
> >> To: jaime.escalante@gmx.com
> >> Cc: "Lars Ingebrigtsen" <larsi@gnus.org>, 48764@debbugs.gnu.org
> >> Subject: bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
> >>
> >> jaime.escalante@gmx.com writes:
> >>
> >> > How about mini-buffer entries that require user writing a string. How would
> >> > a user figure out what to do?
> >> >
> >> > Is there any information about basic navigation keys for mini-buffer input in the manual?
> >>
> >> Does the node (info "(emacs) Minibuffer History")[1] in the Emacs manual
> >> count? FWIW, it can be found through index entries such as 'minibuffer
> >> history', 'M-n (minibuffer history)', 'DOWN (minibuffer history)', etc.
> >
> > We are not really talking about mini-buffer history, but mini-buffer input.
>
> The OP refers to <up> and <down>. In the minibuffer, these keys by
> default navigate so-called "minibuffer history", where e.g. <down>
> inserts "future" history, AKA the next default value. So <down> is
> actually "navigating" the list of defaults (completing-read's 7th
> argument), not the list of completions (completing-read's 2nd argument).
For me it was just about cycling through a list of possible inputs.
Correct, it is not about list of completions, but navigating the list
of defaults. I write a lot of code and cannot always remember what
I would be having for input.
> If this is not the kind of input you're referring to, then could you
> please clarify which input you're referring to?
>
> >> For more details on minibuffer keymaps there's also
> >> (info "(emacs) Minibuffer Maps")[2], found e.g. via the index entry
> >> 'C-h r i minibuffer key TAB RET'.
> >>
> >> [1]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-History.html
> >> [2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Minibuffer-Maps.html
> >>
> >> HTH,
>
> --
> Basil
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* bug#48764: [External] : bug#48764: mini-buffer completion
2021-06-01 20:46 ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2021-06-01 21:00 ` jaime.escalante
2021-06-01 21:04 ` jaime.escalante
@ 2021-06-01 21:31 ` Drew Adams
2 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Drew Adams @ 2021-06-01 21:31 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Basil L. Contovounesios, jaime.escalante@gmx.com
Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen, 48764@debbugs.gnu.org
> > Is there any information about basic navigation keys
> > for mini-buffer input in the manual?
>
> Does the node (info "(emacs) Minibuffer History")[1] in the Emacs manual
> count?
FWIW, I wouldn't refer (or want Emacs to refer) to
keys that you use to cycle among history or default
elements (`M-(p|n)', `M-(r|s)') or cycle among
completion candidates (`<down>', `<up') as
"navigation keys" (basic or non-basic).
They are cycling keys. Yes, they help you access
something, to choose it for some purpose. So they
"get you to" something, in a way, but they're not
motion keys - they don't move point or the mouse
pointer etc.
Keys such as `M-f' navigate in the minibuffer.
Keys that cycle among choices don't. It's clear
enough, I think, to refer to such keys as "cycling
keys". It confuses things to refer to them as
navigation keys.
Yes, I realize that we also sometimes speak about
"navigating" when referring to using menus or
searching, etc., whether or not the end result is
moving the cursor.
But when talking about the minibuffer, where there
really are motion keys, I think it's clearer to
call such keys "cycling", not "navigation".
Just one opinion.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread