From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Christopher Dimech Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Auto Fill Comments Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2020 23:55:18 +0100 Message-ID: References: <83pn3zp8bu.fsf@gnu.org> <20201127160216.GA27998@tuxteam.de> <20201127175346.GB27998@tuxteam.de> <87zh324fa9.fsf@web.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="15033"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: Michael Heerdegen Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Nov 27 23:59:28 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kimi7-0003nI-Fx for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 27 Nov 2020 23:59:27 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:44858 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kimi6-0005iy-BB for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 27 Nov 2020 17:59:26 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:51848) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kimeB-0004fV-Kd for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Nov 2020 17:55:24 -0500 Original-Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.19]:46619) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kime9-0005Ro-6Y for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Nov 2020 17:55:23 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1606517718; bh=M2BAbbPmNJZRq4c3tF4XgH/M4+ixpdnZoUepY8iaalA=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:References; b=C2zk/19JLGgxZh1bZbSm3b5oBUQc5nZx/+92xdjyWNfuwXsnaFfBievhPcnmJxvY8 x6KdQURadqsxq/OisaYk1+0wPyN6Z0SRcvSM7C6WRwExUz0PscxsbVwAZSQRvVed6d zDC8SDDdvS+QoHOs9zZug+ekDh/V43DsK+QQTix8= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Original-Received: from [213.165.168.94] ([213.165.168.94]) by web-mail.gmx.net (3c-app-mailcom-bs12.server.lan [172.19.170.180]) (via HTTP); Fri, 27 Nov 2020 23:55:18 +0100 Importance: normal Sensitivity: Normal In-Reply-To: <87zh324fa9.fsf@web.de> X-UI-Message-Type: mail X-Priority: 3 X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:hhdQ83o7jqt4HrFIu8fFc0Mk26tlQMIU3vLcKmo7lc+sHj5F/AuZ6qTPu0Z/pHDzAHy+7 ZUqgkbmk2BaFKxbfBNL/++ZcpdDZ9wcMjF4g7uI6+EcjP5LmcXptySw/2+o1xKyDyP3MQXM9Xnr+ YfHB0/jLa0vVFQ8+tgMKpKpKknxUI/A6QeafDmPt/fYu5NIXZMQr5bn2irJBcH39gATeVQ/bUwsN pXilCyBtGI5gEn+IigOHgK4Un9fPnIBlXyBZ3sH1LoIeJQLvH8fTpzt7H6PM5KdD81ATkl+e32KV j4= X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:WfyQSzTZzHY=:Ch0lo1GaEOaqe4CUUSxBxd LR8PpF81ZkRQqKx2niFzV35+jMyN/Fb4fj/fICuAbMElgVOPOZam1eI85sCjQw0hp2lu8vvK1 ytgNCDuKoCX9kTqMjj0OQcpM4Cj84FjCrqlKj94Gy1gzpm/qlxlV6Ceey/5gglNCsv7c7SKRM c1oObGaRQS0YTznuZqChg9sKpeNN1P8ghq7MpL4BIFd01gZpjRXXqRW4NfxYch/RICMWPIcnU 6OPoOQQ714anwAQO/9zpH3d65lvz8i6LI14Llr/qZsBMaBaEZHO+cLUPOVsRKr7H4Q4tL/j+5 xpFUUDla4MDgN4UQ8jLHO9fQro8hWw42Q51vWd2Fr/4M2RTij4k/6s4WLNuvcnjXpGjeky6LS kAlb52KNbCmEDyJso8bkSTj76NkSfXP38oMJqolybsbwnV8B5gymyoMMozUBZucspvMagZITG 7q9xJTkWv6BD8Cg+WLEl7wlxNFzNLJ90W8G2HuBt6IkwPhibI9SMzyb3+3tsLuOvnEi0IUK8M fJes5A0ddzdoljjBFEKtqEYt0FrJ4Kt0euJJj6WZoaiVjxQAlteQ1YnrGnp3cSQ6VQl1MVGte rx1nHknyksAKg= Received-SPF: pass client-ip=212.227.15.19; envelope-from=dimech@gmx.com; helo=mout.gmx.net X-Spam_score_int: -25 X-Spam_score: -2.6 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:125704 Archived-At: > Sent: Friday, November 27, 2020 at 11:15 PM > From: "Michael Heerdegen" > To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org > Subject: Re: Auto Fill Comments > > Christopher Dimech writes: > > > Agreed. But telling users that one does not work for them is > > excessive, to say the least. > > Taking care of this manual is excessive. I have much respect for > the work Eli is doing. > > You can never write a manual that fits everyone's expectations. It fits > mine quite well. Yours not, obviously. > > But guess you are working on that manual over years, for thousands of > hours probably. Say, 90% of people like it, and 10 % don't like it. > What you get is that these 90% post, "hey, I've read that manual, it was > great" and eh - no, ehm, they say... nothing, you seldom hear from them; > and 10% don't like it and are frustrated and tell you it sucks, please > rewrite. They didn't really read it and don't really know what they are > talking about because they can't estimate what it covers and why. > > And if you ask for help everybody is suddenly quiet. Yes, that can be problematic. I am the founder of an Official Gnu Package myself. So I'm not here just to rant. I will write an emacs lisp manual for users who know some lisp and would like something to chew on that they can manage. Somehow, freedom respecting software must became part of formal work. The fact that after all these years it has not means we are basically doing things wrong. Yet, on the International Space Station, it has became formal work. I know because I worked with the Solar Dynamics Observatory back in 2010 and now in Submarine Surveillance. > I would be pissed > off. I don't know where Eli's motivation comes from. > > Michael. > > >