From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: ndame Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Making Emacs more friendly to newcomers (was: "Why is emacs so square?") Date: Sun, 19 Apr 2020 08:12:20 +0000 Message-ID: References: <863691n4xl.wl-me@enzu.ru> <87imhw431x.fsf@yahoo.com> <87mu78huhx.fsf_-_@yahoo.com> Reply-To: ndame Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="126661"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Po Lu , Richard Stallman , Ahmed Khanzada , "joseph.h.garvin@gmail.com" , "stefan@marxist.se" , "emacs-devel@gnu.org" , "eliz@gnu.org" , "drew.adams@oracle.com" To: =?UTF-8?B?7KGw7ISx67mI?= Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Apr 19 10:13:05 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jQ54a-000Wpl-PQ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 19 Apr 2020 10:13:04 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:39034 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jQ54Z-0005G0-Q2 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 19 Apr 2020 04:13:03 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:51172) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jQ541-0004pV-LI for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 19 Apr 2020 04:12:29 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jQ540-00063J-3I for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 19 Apr 2020 04:12:29 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-40130.protonmail.ch ([185.70.40.130]:43818) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jQ53z-0005zF-KF; Sun, 19 Apr 2020 04:12:27 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=protonmail.com; s=protonmail; t=1587283944; bh=TcLXT+qza90w8BbhWB2nF3Yuu1k/e9wm5g1W0bAt0lY=; h=Date:To:From:Cc:Reply-To:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=SP/X7cQ9ThFyoHR4ggv1Xrqgk02TH+VSiJtL/0F9KJYTLw7jUalbuFF2k1hn3glfN QXmAd2gyZGWPbu08hZtQuC8GgrXlLoq8cRtgqIayp/yXfQNhALo4MAAgd2MleYeyIO zCINeefQtcrBUw6qoYSdgU+1jvCe4++hXqJz6YhU= In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.70.40.130; envelope-from=ndame@protonmail.com; helo=mail-40130.protonmail.ch X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 185.70.40.130 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:247297 Archived-At: > > I personally find that the stance of trying to not breaking anything is > one of the big reasons that Emacs has a nonusable-without-configuration U= X. > Major version numbers are there for a reason=E2=80=A6 and we can expect f= or annoyed > people to set some variables to get old behavior. Yes, these changes should be clearly marked in NEWS, so those who don't wan= t them, can revert them. Out of the box Emacs should be instantly usable for newcomers and older use= rs could adapt for the sake of Emacs. I wouldn't mind adding a line to my .ema= cs to turn something off which I don't need, but which can make the life of new users easier. For example, CUA mode could be on by default. I would turn it off, but it c= ould make the life of new users easier if they didn't have to turn it on explici= tly and they could use their copy/paste keys from the start like they are used = it to in other tools.