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From: Barry Fishman <barry_fishman@acm.org>
To: emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Emacs vista build failures
Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 19:52:18 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <m3r69gryod.fsf@barry_fishman.acm.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: E1KMrOq-0006OT-G9@fencepost.gnu.org

Richard M Stallman <rms@gnu.org> writes:

>     Hmm.  What if that software written on w32 has satisfied users?
>
> Our mission is not "satisfying users", it is establishing freedom.
>
> There are users who do not think their freedom is very important, and
> they may feel satisfied using proprietary software.  (It isn't ALL
> badly written.)  But that doesn't make the proprietary software a good
> thing.
>
> Freedom is important even if some people don't understand this, and
> taking away people's freedom is bad even if they are foolish enough
> not to care.  We do not judge right and wrong by their standards.

I think you may be loosing sight of some things by still focusing just
on gaining freedom.  A GNU system now exists that people can use
reliably and productively.  Many of us prefer it over the proprietary
alternatives, even if they were free.  Isn't that real freedom.  For
many of us you have already won.

The FSF seems to behave as if this wasn't true.  So much effort still
seems to be put into porting prorietary garbage like .NET to GNU, and
producing a Gnome windowing environment which has all the faults of
MS-Windows.

Why not concentrate on producing something better.  Emacs is far nicer
to work with than GNOME.  So why the interest in making Emacs fit in to
this inferior MS-Windows like environment.  Why not make GNOME work more
like Emacs.  Whats the point of a C based GTK it you don't use it
through a Lisp like layer?  Why is so much of my Gnome configuration
buried in zillions of directories filled with ugly XML files.  Why can't
I query it with simple REPL?

I don't have problems with porting Emacs to Vista.  My problem is with
this strong desire to port Vista to GNU.

-- 
Barry Fishman





  reply	other threads:[~2008-07-26 23:52 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 279+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <36366a980807091202rd3b6521jc9fa45d321bc9d37@mail.gmail.com>
2008-07-11  0:02 ` Emacs vista build failures Eric Hanchrow
2008-07-11 16:49   ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-11 19:05     ` David Robinow
2008-07-11 23:33       ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-12  7:57         ` David Kastrup
2008-07-12 16:35           ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-12 17:21             ` David Kastrup
2008-07-13  9:35               ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-13  9:46                 ` David Kastrup
2008-07-14 11:05                   ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-11 19:17     ` David Robinow
2008-07-11 20:39       ` Miles Bader
2008-07-11 20:45         ` David Robinow
2008-07-11 20:57           ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-12 16:35             ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-12 19:46               ` Bastien Guerry
2008-07-12 20:17                 ` David Kastrup
2008-07-12 10:49           ` Bastien Guerry
2008-07-12 16:35           ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-12 20:40             ` David Robinow
2008-07-12 22:47               ` Bastien
2008-07-13 19:10               ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-13 20:44                 ` Claus
     [not found]                   ` <87tzet8c3i.fsf@offby1.atm01.sea.blarg.net>
2008-07-14  8:43                     ` Claus
2008-07-15  3:06                       ` Eric Hanchrow
2008-07-14 17:38                   ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-13 20:46               ` Chong Yidong
2008-07-13 21:46                 ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-13 21:40                   ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-07-13 22:53                     ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-13 22:53                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-13 23:46                         ` Miles Bader
2008-07-14 10:27                       ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-07-14 11:58                         ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-14 17:39                           ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-14 19:33                             ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-15 18:04                           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-07-15 20:29                             ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-15 21:02                             ` Chong Yidong
2008-07-15 23:42                               ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-16  1:42                                 ` Stefan Monnier
2008-07-16  1:58                                   ` Miles Bader
2008-07-16  2:43                                     ` Stefan Monnier
2008-07-16  3:01                                       ` Miles Bader
2008-07-16  4:44                                       ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-16  4:43                                   ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-14 10:45                       ` Miles Bader
2008-07-14 12:24                         ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-14 12:20                           ` joakim
2008-07-14 12:32                             ` David Kastrup
2008-07-15 18:04                           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-07-13 21:48                   ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-13 23:26                     ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-13 23:22                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-14 20:42                         ` Don Armstrong
2008-07-14 21:05                           ` David Kastrup
2008-07-16 14:36                             ` Manoj Srivastava
2008-07-16 15:20                               ` David Kastrup
2008-07-16 22:04                                 ` Manoj Srivastava
2008-07-16 21:23                               ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-07-16 22:17                                 ` Manoj Srivastava
2008-07-17  8:31                                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-07-14 22:30                           ` Debian's idiosyncratic complexification of Emacs [Was: Emacs vista build failures] Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-14 23:54                             ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-07-15  1:05                               ` Debian's idiosyncratic complexification of Emacs Miles Bader
2008-07-15  7:11                                 ` Geoffrey Teale
2008-07-15  8:12                                   ` Miles Bader
2008-07-15  9:48                                     ` David Kastrup
2008-07-15  5:58                               ` Ralf Angeli
2008-07-15  6:50                                 ` David Kastrup
2008-07-15 18:09                                   ` Ralf Angeli
2008-07-15 21:53                                     ` David Kastrup
2008-07-16 14:22                                   ` Manoj Srivastava
2008-07-16 15:22                                     ` David Kastrup
2008-07-16 20:42                                     ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-07-16 22:26                                       ` Manoj Srivastava
2008-07-17  8:46                                         ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-07-18  9:08                                         ` Agustin Martin
2008-07-15  1:38                             ` Debian's idiosyncratic complexification of Emacs [Was: Emacs vista build failures] Don Armstrong
2008-07-15  2:20                               ` Debian's idiosyncratic complexification of Emacs Stefan Monnier
2008-07-15  6:43                                 ` Don Armstrong
2008-07-15  6:55                               ` Debian's idiosyncratic complexification of Emacs [Was: Emacs vista build failures] Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-07-15 10:15                               ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-15 10:08                                 ` Debian's idiosyncratic complexification of Emacs David Kastrup
2008-07-16 14:09                                 ` Manoj Srivastava
2008-07-16 16:34                                   ` Stefan Monnier
2008-07-16 19:43                               ` Karl Fogel
2008-07-16 19:59                                 ` Karl Fogel
2008-07-16 21:59                                 ` Manoj Srivastava
2008-07-21 21:26                                   ` Karl Fogel
2008-07-22  4:27                                     ` Miles Bader
2008-07-22 14:21                                       ` Manoj Srivastava
2008-07-23  5:13                                       ` Michael Olson
2008-07-23 19:49                                         ` Stefan Monnier
2008-07-24 17:44                                           ` Manoj Srivastava
2008-07-24 20:20                                             ` Stefan Monnier
2008-07-22 14:22                                     ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-14  1:42                     ` Emacs vista build failures Stefan Monnier
2008-07-14 17:38                     ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-14 17:38                   ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-14 19:56                     ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-15  8:28                       ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-15  7:54                         ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-15  8:52                           ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-15  8:57                         ` David Kastrup
2008-07-15 17:14                           ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-17 22:54                         ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-17 23:48                           ` Miles Bader
2008-07-19 17:06                             ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-20  4:08                               ` Miles Bader
2008-07-20 17:21                                 ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-20 20:22                                   ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-21  3:29                                     ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-21 11:29                                       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-21 13:59                                         ` Miles Bader
2008-07-21 17:55                                           ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-21 18:05                                             ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-21 18:37                                               ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-21 18:49                                                 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-21 19:30                                                   ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-21 19:36                                                     ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-21 22:54                                                       ` Evans Winner
2008-07-22  6:47                                                         ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22  8:16                                                         ` Jason Rumney
2008-07-22  8:26                                                           ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 13:46                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-22 13:58                                                             ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 14:34                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-22 17:22                                                             ` James Cloos
2008-07-22 17:31                                                               ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 20:11                                                             ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-07-22 20:19                                                               ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 22:14                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-22 22:23                                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-23  6:59                                                                   ` Stephen Leake
2008-07-23  8:20                                                                     ` Jason Rumney
2008-07-23 12:49                                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-23  8:45                                                                     ` David Kastrup
2008-07-23  6:35                                                                 ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 20:06                                                           ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-07-22 20:24                                                             ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 20:31                                                               ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 20:45                                                                 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 20:59                                                                   ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 21:03                                                                     ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 22:18                                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-21 22:47                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-21 23:11                                                   ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 13:13                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-22 13:24                                                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 13:51                                                         ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 13:57                                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-22 14:34                                                           ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 15:12                                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-22 15:21                                                               ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 17:29                                                     ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-21 23:55                                                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-07-22  3:41                                                   ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-22 13:28                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-22 14:04                                                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 14:11                                                         ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 14:39                                                           ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 14:47                                                             ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 14:52                                                               ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 15:00                                                                 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 15:13                                                                   ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 15:18                                                                     ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 15:20                                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-22 15:22                                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-22 15:26                                                                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 22:11                                                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-23  6:32                                                                           ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 18:52                                                               ` Sven Joachim
2008-07-22 19:12                                                                 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 19:33                                                                   ` Sean O'Rourke
2008-07-22 14:42                                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-22 14:57                                                           ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22 14:37                                                       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-23  2:26                                                     ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-23  3:40                                                       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-23  3:45                                                         ` Miles Bader
2008-07-24  2:24                                                         ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-24  3:34                                                           ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-24  2:44                                                         ` Stefan Monnier
2008-07-24  3:29                                                           ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-22 17:29                                               ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-22 17:35                                                 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22 18:40                                                   ` David Kastrup
2008-07-26 11:06                                                     ` Bastien
2008-07-23 16:56                                                   ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-23 17:42                                                     ` Johannes Weiner
2008-07-24  0:06                                                     ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-24  5:25                                                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-24 22:04                                                       ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-24 22:26                                                         ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-24 23:15                                                           ` Nick Roberts
2008-07-24 23:22                                                             ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-26  1:23                                                               ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-26  1:23                                                           ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-24 23:12                                                         ` Óscar Fuentes
2008-07-26  1:23                                                           ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-26  6:23                                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-26  6:45                                                             ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-26  7:07                                                               ` Stefan Monnier
2008-07-25  3:20                                                         ` Miles Bader
2008-07-26  1:24                                                           ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-25 14:18                                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-26  1:24                                                           ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-26  6:21                                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-24  8:07                                                     ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-24 10:20                                                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-24 22:05                                                         ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-25 14:20                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-25 14:51                                                             ` David Kastrup
2008-07-25 15:08                                                               ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-25 15:38                                                                 ` David Kastrup
2008-07-25 15:55                                                                   ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-25 16:08                                                                     ` David Kastrup
2008-07-25 16:19                                                                       ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-25 15:40                                                                 ` Juanma Barranquero
2008-07-25 15:56                                                                   ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-26 20:31                                                                 ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-26 20:56                                                                   ` Stefan Monnier
2008-07-25 19:21                                                               ` Stefan Monnier
2008-07-26  6:03                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-26  1:24                                                             ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-26  6:19                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-26  8:03                                                             ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-26  8:50                                                               ` David Kastrup
2008-07-26  9:22                                                                 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-26  9:50                                                                   ` David Kastrup
2008-07-26  9:55                                                                     ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-26 10:15                                                                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-26 10:32                                                                         ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-26 10:29                                                                 ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-26 11:11                                                                   ` David Kastrup
2008-07-26 12:33                                                                     ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-26 14:26                                                                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-26 21:34                                                               ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-26 23:52                                                                 ` Barry Fishman [this message]
2008-07-27 17:14                                                                   ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-28  0:05                                                                     ` Barry Fishman
2008-07-28 21:47                                                                       ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-29  1:00                                                                         ` Barry Fishman
2008-07-29  6:21                                                                           ` tomas
2008-07-29 15:21                                                                             ` Barry Fishman
2008-07-30  3:46                                                                               ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-30  3:47                                                                             ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-30  3:47                                                                           ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-25  5:35                                                       ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-22 17:29                                             ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-21 16:48                                         ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-22  2:48                                         ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-21 13:55                                       ` Miles Bader
2008-07-20 20:36                                   ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-21  3:29                                     ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-21  6:14                                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-21  9:04                                       ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-07-22  2:48                                         ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-20  6:35                               ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-07-20 22:05                                 ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-20 22:05                                 ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-21  0:43                                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-07-21 14:37                                     ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-21 14:51                                       ` David Kastrup
2008-07-22  2:49                                         ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-22 12:46                                           ` David Kastrup
2008-07-23  2:27                                             ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-22  8:02                                       ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-07-22 16:31                                         ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-18  0:05                           ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-19 17:05                             ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-19 21:34                               ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-23 18:17                               ` Karl Berry
2008-07-23 20:18                                 ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-24  6:19                                   ` Gilaras Drakeson
2008-07-25  5:35                                     ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-25  7:08                                       ` Thomas Lord
2008-07-21  5:14 christophe

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