From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: storm@cua.dk (Kim F. Storm) Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 22:24:55 +0100 Message-ID: References: <00e301c509c1$9c761690$0200a8c0@sedrcw11488> <200502152320.j1FNKd310641@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <200502172257.j1HMvJN10856@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <200502181412.j1IECkj14736@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <200502182259.j1IMx6g23511@raven.dms.auburn.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1108849203 8799 80.91.229.2 (19 Feb 2005 21:40:03 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 21:40:03 +0000 (UTC) Cc: lennart.borgman.073@student.lu.se, rms@gnu.org, drew.adams@oracle.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Feb 19 22:40:02 2005 Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1D2cKL-0003gB-80 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 22:39:49 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1D2cax-00060i-Kb for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:56:59 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1D2cWJ-0004S8-2w for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:52:11 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1D2cW7-0004MQ-Vk for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:52:01 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1D2cW7-0004GV-OF for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:51:59 -0500 Original-Received: from [195.41.46.237] (helo=pfepc.post.tele.dk) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1D2c5x-00019G-68; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:24:57 -0500 Original-Received: from kfs-l.imdomain.dk.cua.dk (0x503e2644.bynxx3.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk [80.62.38.68]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 4D0E226281A; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 22:24:55 +0100 (CET) Original-To: Luc Teirlinck In-Reply-To: <200502182259.j1IMx6g23511@raven.dms.auburn.edu> (Luc Teirlinck's message of "Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:59:06 -0600 (CST)") User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.0.50 (gnu/linux) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org X-MailScanner-To: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:33635 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:33635 Luc Teirlinck writes: > You completely misunderstand again. I think I have understood your idea of "typical usage pattern", I just disagree that it is "typical". > I am talking about just _looking_ > at items in a "Value Menu", not about setting anything. Ok, but if a novice user starts from option 1, changes it in various ways to see what the possible values are, goes on to option 2, does the same, and so on, until he reaches option 15, and then he sees a setting of that option which he finds useful -- and then uses "Save" -- expecting that all the other changes he made to options 1-14 will not be saved -- well that's a really stupid user IMHO. But that's how you claim most novice users will act -- so IMO you think they are stupid... > The whole buffer buttons make merely *looking* at the choices you > have, or wanting to read their docs, a dangerous activity. As long as you don't use "Save", it's perfectly safe! > If customize is so dangerous, it should really be off-limits for > everybody... > > Customize is not too dangerous, the whole buffer buttons are too > dangerous. They probably should indeed be off limits for everybody. > I suggest getting rid of them. I disagree 100% --- most users will be familiar with the concept of "saving all changes with one click". Very few are familiar with a concept that forces you to save each change individually.