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From: Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>
To: Sebastian Wiesner <lunaryorn@gmail.com>
Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>, emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: call for more ert tests
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2013 22:44:48 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <m3ehbpq5rz.fsf@stories.gnus.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CALf2awSLq=U=_OZKB3R5+sdj3yOGgqUxg5E2MdDhJREq84UW_Q@mail.gmail.com> (Sebastian Wiesner's message of "Tue, 25 Jun 2013 22:36:29 +0200")

Sebastian Wiesner <lunaryorn@gmail.com> writes:

> Actually, you aren't done… you are just out-sourcing your work, i.e.
> regression testing, to your users.  In the absence of tests, you will
> never realize that your quick change of "li" rendering accidentally
> broke "a" rendering until the first user complains and sends you back
> to the keyboard in order to debug the bug which you introduced.

Sounds unlikely.  When I fix a the rendering, the page is there right in
the buffer as I'm coding, and <a> mess-ups would be pretty immediately
obvious.

And if I miss it, somebody will tell me, as you say.

So in this scenario, having to fiddle with the test cases to make the
change "pass" means more work for me, for a very unlikely gain, which
(in the unlikely case of me making an error!!!) would be discovered by
somebody else.

So there's nothing to gain here for the Emacs developers.

And I think that people writing other highly interactive and non-vital
stuff has started to find this out in general the last few years.  On
Hacker News there's constantly people popping up who've seen the light
-- having too many automatic tests means ossifying the software.  The
TDD nightmare is almost over now, and Emacs survived without gaining too
many useless automatic tests while the fad lasted.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  bloggy blog http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no/



  reply	other threads:[~2013-06-25 20:44 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 60+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2013-06-24 17:31 call for more ert tests Glenn Morris
2013-06-24 18:21 ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-24 18:24   ` Lennart Borgman
2013-07-01 11:35     ` Andreas Röhler
2013-07-01 16:14       ` Stefan Merten
2013-07-01 16:35         ` Andreas Röhler
2013-07-01 16:37       ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-07-01 17:35         ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-07-01 18:44           ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2013-07-01 19:32             ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-07-01 20:34         ` Dmitry Gutov
2013-06-24 18:33   ` Sebastian Wiesner
2013-06-24 18:40     ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-24 18:55       ` Sebastian Wiesner
2013-06-24 19:16         ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-24 19:20           ` Lennart Borgman
2013-06-24 19:35           ` Óscar Fuentes
2013-06-24 19:59             ` John Wiegley
2013-06-25  1:21               ` Leo Liu
2013-06-25  2:44                 ` John Wiegley
2013-06-25  3:02                   ` Stefan Monnier
2013-06-25  2:31             ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2013-06-25 14:38               ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-25 11:06             ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2013-06-25 12:11               ` Juanma Barranquero
2013-06-25 15:15               ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-25 19:18                 ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2013-06-25 20:12                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-25 20:36                   ` Sebastian Wiesner
2013-06-25 20:44                     ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen [this message]
2013-06-28 15:01                       ` Ted Zlatanov
2013-06-28 15:39                         ` Juanma Barranquero
2013-06-28 15:41                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2013-06-26  9:03                     ` Julien Danjou
2013-06-26  5:12                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2013-06-24 19:46   ` Glenn Morris
2013-06-25 13:33     ` Noah Lavine
2013-06-25 17:18   ` Rüdiger Sonderfeld
2013-06-25 18:53     ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-25 20:29       ` Dmitry Gutov
2013-07-01 11:45   ` Andreas Röhler
2013-07-01 12:43     ` Ted Zlatanov
2013-07-01 14:13       ` Andreas Röhler
2013-06-24 18:29 ` David Engster
2013-06-24 18:38   ` Glenn Morris
2013-06-24 19:04     ` David Engster
2013-06-25 22:15 ` Daniel Hackney
2013-06-26  9:22 ` Stefan Merten
2013-06-26 12:17   ` Bozhidar Batsov
2013-06-26 15:52     ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-26 16:03       ` Bozhidar Batsov
2013-06-26 16:22         ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-26 19:01           ` Dmitry Gutov
2013-06-26 19:10             ` Michael Albinus
2013-06-26 19:34               ` Dmitry Gutov
2013-06-26 19:56                 ` Michael Albinus
2013-06-26 19:28             ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-26 19:46             ` Teemu Likonen
2013-06-26 15:50   ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-06-29 15:11     ` Stefan Merten

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