From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Thomas Fitzsimmons Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#41386: 28.0.50; Gnus nnimap OAuth 2.0 support Date: Wed, 20 May 2020 12:16:16 -0400 Message-ID: References: <87y2poqehh.fsf@gnus.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="121883"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: larsi@gnus.org, rms@gnu.org, 41386@debbugs.gnu.org To: Stefan Kangas Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed May 20 18:17:12 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jbRP5-000VbL-HR for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 20 May 2020 18:17:11 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:46146 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jbRP4-0000sf-Ch for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 20 May 2020 12:17:10 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:45648) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jbROw-0000qo-O0 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 20 May 2020 12:17:02 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:42556) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jbROw-00077Z-EH for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 20 May 2020 12:17:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jbROw-0007lH-AE for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 20 May 2020 12:17:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Thomas Fitzsimmons Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 20 May 2020 16:17:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 41386 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 41386-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B41386.158999138629783 (code B ref 41386); Wed, 20 May 2020 16:17:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 41386) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 May 2020 16:16:26 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54102 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jbROL-0007kJ-SW for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 20 May 2020 12:16:26 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-qk1-f195.google.com ([209.85.222.195]:33515) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jbROJ-0007k5-Sd for 41386@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 20 May 2020 12:16:24 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-qk1-f195.google.com with SMTP id z80so4171199qka.0 for <41386@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 20 May 2020 09:16:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=fitzsim-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version; bh=Jie2x/R3QHapOAfiFc50aYWHQ6M3CHCboCf0UB9RjG8=; b=pN0zF+UeY1s/B3qLZCeuLRpnk85WPq5FD5q7oTzKxaFsASA+V2CKE83ykERuX6OOmq 6jE51l1zJOwXXefTmWfrNSxhf22nUGpG8tjfWSq8R8VRXeoLBqi/4fr0sfdDBAuQUoSo n4AxZWVHApenTVhYAdr2eNBugh9IWaeMfES2hcqLXsUG6IsJ7l2YO7J/vUAsjCBPy+zv HcL5z9fIHAtzUqTYmyyLplZjSAkbBOoaJdPxUHDGWwsJd5C40K4/oUxVheoWSW2orqLm KTnZTxvNLMyF7L8HAJEqS/wmhME5a5zhZ+QthpMbtKJ69wBdn9VxvIZBuEjhVAGGjcq4 GR1g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=Jie2x/R3QHapOAfiFc50aYWHQ6M3CHCboCf0UB9RjG8=; b=gv7X9ZY9/jQYZ3KavZXdoOvElHSciJ1wnx1ZcRcQeB48Pp9D7Nl6TI6JTqgOrL96Ku nODkuGfSdtzLEq55bhi3pGIH/vlaY4EVF8U596A0YZnVIvJv744iym75pnQGUMHnud+C rBRcSpgm/Og0atcIASoXLjdvj/CI92cLemh/uUWfbNCqbc28J9riIA/myY17DLwmw6jT GOWU0Wp2zTBkzGkt/3rcXa9TukAnV0Hnpr3OCwXzOUylNlsGuxEh0xpxx6IcqqkuuAOJ kYbh5/ImrhBOLbjLTJOHYNMTqICeu5wWc3CAe/8nx/2o7z1aB5xwQanR7xpKSaOBKUVe GvzA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532fWyW/AabXs6wp8UddyJ2nVqNtjIgOumTVNyIKM+pZQ5jde2Jr 3EzjQ0JDjCivihevINWVrkNVpuJcofcVgTBm X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxtlvDf+e5gOO0ZAR1Uoy3ejlw2IqLIO8AW1AILNnbzU2Epq3Hq+CAwuipTnIMbiZjXrmRc+w== X-Received: by 2002:a37:a885:: with SMTP id r127mr5618516qke.93.1589991377861; Wed, 20 May 2020 09:16:17 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from localhost.localdomain (69-165-165-189.dsl.teksavvy.com. [69.165.165.189]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g7sm1883945qkk.44.2020.05.20.09.16.17 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 20 May 2020 09:16:17 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: (Stefan Kangas's message of "Wed, 20 May 2020 06:32:17 -0700") X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:180668 Archived-At: Hi Stefan, Stefan Kangas writes: > Richard Stallman writes: > >> [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] >> [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] >> [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] >> >> This is alarming news. If these reports are correct, they mean that >> Google will entirely cut off access to Gmail from the Free World. >> >> Can you find a web page that describes the danger in a clear way, >> with references to substantiate the warning? That is the first thing >> we need in order to campaign to convince Google not to do it. > > Here are two relevant announcements, I think: > > Turning off less secure app access to G Suite accounts > https://gsuiteupdates.googleblog.com/2019/12/less-secure-apps-oauth-google-username-password-incorrect.html > > Less secure app turn-off suspended until further notice > https://gsuiteupdates.googleblog.com/2020/03/less-secure-app-turn-off-suspended.html > > [...] Yes, those are the relevant announcements, thanks. Quoting from the first announcement: "If you are using Thunderbird or another email client, re-add your Google Account and configure it to use IMAP with OAuth." It seems like Google is acknowledging Thunderbird as a valid option post-"less-secure-app" turn-off there. Richard, I think Lars's and David's summary of Thunderbird's situation highlights the non-technical issues blocking GNU Emacs from supporting OAuth 2.0 access to the G Suite IMAP service. I'm wondering if the FSF could help with those issues. > So I guess this means that in the mid-term, people should seriously > consider leaving Google. Agreed, and I am [1], but maybe a better outcome could be reached. It sounds like from Thunderbird's situation, changes to Google's developer terms of service, giving some consideration to Free Software projects using these APIs, could solve the problem. It might take non-technical discussions between the FSF and Google, but that's one of the FSF's functions, AIUI. Maybe the result could be a model for how to handle other similar situations, since Emacs needing "API keys" to access network services is not unique to G Suite or Google. Thomas 1. I'm tempted to try Lars's self-hosted email script. ;-)