Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Edward O'Connor]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 848 bytes --]

RMS wrote, several months ago, about my json.el:

> If a lot of people start wanting this facility, then it would be good
> to include it in Emacs. Please let me know if that happens.

I know of several libraries/tools which use json.el, including
augment.el, a facebook api client, rcov.el, and at least one twitter api
client. Additionally, I know of at least one library, twit.el, whose
author avoided using json.el solely because it isn't included in Emacs.
From twit.el's commentary:

> This uses Twitter's XML-based api, not the JSON one because i would
> like to avoid making the user install third-party libraries to use it.

I'm not sure if this counts as "a lot," but I would be quite happy to
include json.el with Emacs if you'd like it. I believe I have the
relevant papers on file.

I've attached the latest version for your perusal.


[-- Attachment #2: JavaScript Object Notation parser/generator --]
[-- Type: application/emacs-lisp, Size: 18432 bytes --]

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Leo]

On 2008-02-11 19:46 +0000, Edward O'Connor wrote:
>> If a lot of people start wanting this facility, then it would be good
>> to include it in Emacs. Please let me know if that happens.
>
> I know of several libraries/tools which use json.el, including
> augment.el, a facebook api client, rcov.el, and at least one twitter api
> client. Additionally, I know of at least one library, twit.el, whose
> author avoided using json.el solely because it isn't included in Emacs.
> From twit.el's commentary:

Hi Edward,

Can you give the list a summary of the features provided by json? Is it
useful to include another facility xml-rpc.el? Thank you.

Bye,
-- 
.:  Leo  :.  [ sdl.web AT gmail.com ]  .:  [ GPG Key: 9283AA3F ]  :.

          Use the best OS -- http://www.fedoraproject.org/

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Edward O'Connor]

Leo wrote:

> Can you give the list a summary of the features provided by json?

json.el provides facilities for reading (parsing) and printing
(generating) JSON data. JSON, JavaScript Object Notation, is a
lightweight data serialization format based on the object literal
notation of JavaScript.

> Is it useful to include another facility xml-rpc.el? Thank you.

json.el and xml-rpc.el are totally unrelated.


Ted

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Phil Hagelberg]

Edward O'Connor <hober0@gmail.com> writes:

> I know of several libraries/tools which use json.el, including
> augment.el, a facebook api client, rcov.el, and at least one twitter api
> client. Additionally, I know of at least one library, twit.el, whose
> author avoided using json.el solely because it isn't included in Emacs.

I've found this library to be very useful too and have written a library
that depends on it. Chalk up another vote to have it included. I think
as web APIs start becoming more and more common the usefulness of this
library will increase greatly.

-Phil

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Richard Stallman]

    > If a lot of people start wanting this facility, then it would be good
    > to include it in Emacs. Please let me know if that happens.

    I know of several libraries/tools which use json.el, including
    augment.el, a facebook api client, rcov.el, and at least one twitter api
    client. Additionally, I know of at least one library, twit.el, whose
    author avoided using json.el solely because it isn't included in Emacs.

That sounds like plenty of usage.

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[T. V. Raman]

And I use json.el in emacspeak/g-client -- an emacs binding to
the various Google services.


>>>>> "Ted" == Edward O'Connor <hober0@gmail.com> writes:
    Ted> RMS wrote, several months ago, about my json.el:
    >> If a lot of people start wanting this facility, then it
    >> would be good to include it in Emacs. Please let me know
    >> if that happens.
    Ted> 
    Ted> I know of several libraries/tools which use json.el,
    Ted> including augment.el, a facebook api client, rcov.el,
    Ted> and at least one twitter api client. Additionally, I

    Ted> know of at least one library, twit.el, whose author
    Ted> avoided using json.el solely because it isn't included
    Ted> in Emacs.
    >> From twit.el's commentary:
    Ted> 
    >> This uses Twitter's XML-based api, not the JSON one
    >> because i would like to avoid making the user install
    >> third-party libraries to use it.

-- 
Best Regards,
--raman

      
Email:  raman@users.sf.net
WWW:    http://emacspeak.sf.net/raman/
AIM:    emacspeak       GTalk: tv.raman.tv@gmail.com
PGP:    http://emacspeak.sf.net/raman/raman-almaden.asc
Google: tv+raman 
IRC:    irc://irc.freenode.net/#emacs

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Edward O'Connor]

I wrote:

> I would be quite happy to include json.el with Emacs if you'd like it.

RMS replied:

> That sounds like plenty of usage.

Phil Hagelberg and T.V. Raman also replied approving of the add. Would
someone like to pull the trigger? Is there anything else you need from
my end?

-- 
Thanks,
Ted

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Michael Olson]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 784 bytes --]

Edward O'Connor <hober0@gmail.com> writes:

> I wrote:
>
>> I would be quite happy to include json.el with Emacs if you'd like it.
>
> RMS replied:
>
>> That sounds like plenty of usage.
>
> Phil Hagelberg and T.V. Raman also replied approving of the add. Would
> someone like to pull the trigger? Is there anything else you need from
> my end?

I've installed json.el as lisp/net/json.el.  I updated the header and
opted to replace the XEmacs compatibility code with a few defalias
commands, to fix some compiler warnings.

-- 
|       Michael Olson  |  FSF Associate Member #652     |
| http://mwolson.org/  |  Hobbies: Lisp, HCoop          |
| Projects: Emacs, Muse, ERC, EMMS, ErBot, DVC, Planner |
`-------------------------------------------------------'

[-- Attachment #2: Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 188 bytes --]

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Miles Bader]

Michael Olson <mwolson@gnu.org> writes:
> I've installed json.el as lisp/net/json.el.  I updated the header and
> opted to replace the XEmacs compatibility code with a few defalias
> commands, to fix some compiler warnings.

Why did you put it in "net/"??   It's a formatted data I/O library, not
a network protocol...

-Miles

-- 
Religion, n. A daughter of Hope and Fear, explaining to Ignorance the nature
of the Unknowable.

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Michael Olson]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 846 bytes --]

Miles Bader <miles@gnu.org> writes:

> Michael Olson <mwolson@gnu.org> writes:
>> I've installed json.el as lisp/net/json.el.  I updated the header and
>> opted to replace the XEmacs compatibility code with a few defalias
>> commands, to fix some compiler warnings.
>
> Why did you put it in "net/"??  It's a formatted data I/O library, not
> a network protocol...

I placed it there because (1) I recall it being used by programs which
interact with online services and (2) because it mentioned JavaScript,
which is a language used in web-browsers.  Where else do you think it
should go?

-- 
|       Michael Olson  |  FSF Associate Member #652     |
| http://mwolson.org/  |  Hobbies: Lisp, HCoop          |
| Projects: Emacs, Muse, ERC, EMMS, ErBot, DVC, Planner |
`-------------------------------------------------------'

[-- Attachment #2: Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 188 bytes --]

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Phil Hagelberg]

Michael Olson <mwolson@gnu.org> writes:

> I placed it there because (1) I recall it being used by programs which
> interact with online services and (2) because it mentioned JavaScript,
> which is a language used in web-browsers.  Where else do you think it
> should go?

It probably belongs in progmodes/ since JSON is a subset of
Javascript. Now that I think about it, it's somewhat ironic that JSON is
supported but there's no mode for Javascript in Emacs. Have any of the
many Javascript major modes[1] been considered for inclusion?

-Phil
http://technomancy.us

[1] - http://edward.oconnor.cx/2005/09/editing-javascript-in-emacs

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Miles Bader]

Phil Hagelberg <phil@evri.com> writes:
> It probably belongs in progmodes/ since JSON is a subset of
> Javascript. Now that I think about it, it's somewhat ironic that JSON is
> supported but there's no mode for Javascript in Emacs. Have any of the
> many Javascript major modes[1] been considered for inclusion?

AFAIK, the code contributed (json.el) isn't a json "mode" at all, but
rather code to read/write json-formatted data.

If we add a mode for _editing_ json later (json-mode.el or something),
of course, that could go under progmodes/, but I don't think it's
appropriate for json.el.

I'd just put in the lisp root, along with xml.el etc.

-Miles

-- 
Genealogy, n. An account of one's descent from an ancestor who did not
particularly care to trace his own.

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Richard Stallman]

    Now that I think about it, it's somewhat ironic that JSON is
    supported but there's no mode for Javascript in Emacs. Have any of the
    many Javascript major modes[1] been considered for inclusion?

It would be nice to install a good one.  The way to do this is for
someone to study them, rate them, then see which ones' authors will
sign the legal papers.

javascript.el (was: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp)

[Phil Hagelberg]

Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org> writes:

>     Now that I think about it, it's somewhat ironic that JSON is
>     supported but there's no mode for Javascript in Emacs. Have any of the
>     many Javascript major modes[1] been considered for inclusion?
>
> It would be nice to install a good one.  The way to do this is for
> someone to study them, rate them, then see which ones' authors will
> sign the legal papers.

I'll give that a shot and report back with my findings.

-Phil

Re: javascript.el

[Lennart Borgman (gmail)]

Phil Hagelberg wrote:
> Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org> writes:
> 
>>     Now that I think about it, it's somewhat ironic that JSON is
>>     supported but there's no mode for Javascript in Emacs. Have any of the
>>     many Javascript major modes[1] been considered for inclusion?
>>
>> It would be nice to install a good one.  The way to do this is for
>> someone to study them, rate them, then see which ones' authors will
>> sign the legal papers.
> 
> I'll give that a shot and report back with my findings.
> 
> -Phil

Please look at the page

   http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/JavaScriptMode

where there are some comments on this. At the bottom you can see the 
current state as I have seen it. (Though my impression may be erroneous.)

It might be worth looking at what Ahmet Usal has done in Mewde too. 
Unfortunately I have not had time to do that myself.

Re: javascript.el

[Phil Hagelberg]

"Lennart Borgman (gmail)" <lennart.borgman@gmail.com> writes:

>> I'll give that a shot and report back with my findings.
>>
>> -Phil
>
> Please look at the page
>
>   http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/JavaScriptMode
>
> where there are some comments on this. At the bottom you can see the
> current state as I have seen it. (Though my impression may be
> erroneous.)

Oh, I just noticed this. It says that the author of ecmascript-mode.el
recommends javascript.el, so that makes the decision much easier. I will
contact Karl.

> It might be worth looking at what Ahmet Usal has done in Mewde
> too. Unfortunately I have not had time to do that myself.

I think the Mewde/spidermonkey connection code is probably out of scope
of Emacs. In my opinion MozRepl[1] is a much nicer implementation of the
same idea, but it definitely does not belong in Emacs. The speedbar
integration could be nice, but I don't personally use speedbar and am
probably not qualified to comment.

From that page it does look like Joost Diepenmaat has a nice patch to
javascript.el, but that's probably not worth investigating until we hear
back from Karl.

-Phil

[1] -  http://hyperstruct.net/projects/mozrepl/

Re: javascript.el

[Lennart Borgman (gmail)]

Phil Hagelberg wrote:
> "Lennart Borgman (gmail)" <lennart.borgman@gmail.com> writes:
> 
>>> I'll give that a shot and report back with my findings.
>>>
>>> -Phil
>> Please look at the page
>>
>>   http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/JavaScriptMode
>>
>> where there are some comments on this. At the bottom you can see the
>> current state as I have seen it. (Though my impression may be
>> erroneous.)
> 
> Oh, I just noticed this. It says that the author of ecmascript-mode.el
> recommends javascript.el, so that makes the decision much easier. I will
> contact Karl.


As you can see at the bottom of the EmacsWiki page there also seem to be 
some problems with some keywords. I can't remember I have got any answer 
to my question to David.

Re: javascript.el (was: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp)

[Phil Hagelberg]

Phil Hagelberg <phil@evri.com> writes:

> Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org> writes:
>
>>     Now that I think about it, it's somewhat ironic that JSON is
>>     supported but there's no mode for Javascript in Emacs. Have any of the
>>     many Javascript major modes[1] been considered for inclusion?
>>
>> It would be nice to install a good one.  The way to do this is for
>> someone to study them, rate them, then see which ones' authors will
>> sign the legal papers.
>
> I'll give that a shot and report back with my findings.

OK, so I've looked over a total of four modes:

 * javascript-mode.el
 * js-mode.el
 * ecmascript-mode.el
 * javascript.el

All of them are based on cc-mode and licensed under the GPL v2 or
later. The biggest difference seems to be in what they add to
cc-mode.

== javascript-mode.el
http://www.brigadoon.de/peter/javascript-mode.el
By Steven Champeon and Ville Skyttä
Last modified in May of 2006

This one is based on c++-mode. It knows about many JS reserved words
and what constitutes valid identifiers/functions and is included in
XEmacs. The URL given above seems to be the original source, but it's
not responding, so you can get it instead from
http://cvs.xemacs.org/viewcvs.cgi/XEmacs/packages/xemacs-packages/prog-modes/javascript-mode.el

== js-mode.el
http://repo.hyperstruct.net/mozrepl/chrome/content/js-mode.el
By Massimilano Mirra
Last modified in 2006

This one is based on java-mode. It to be an even thinner layer on
cc-mode than the above and treats Javascript code a lot like Java.
The author recommends you use Landstrom's javascript.el, so this one
can safely be considered deprecated.

== emcascript-mode.el
http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/download/ecmascript-mode.el
By David Lindquist
Last modified in 2005

This one is also based on java-mode. It knows a good deal about JS
reserved words and removes things that are in Java but not
Javascript. It claims to also be suitable for ActionScript, but that
is probably true of all of these since the two languages are extremely
similar.

== javascript.el
http://www.brgeight.se/downloads/emacs/javascript.el
By Karl Landstrom
Last modified in 2006

This one is based directly on cc-mode with heavily modifications. It
has a fairly comprehensive knowledge of Javascript reserved words,
identifiers, and functions. Based on my own observations, this seems
to be the favourite of Javascript hackers.


I suspect the best thing to do would be to install one of the last two
modes listed if we can get copyright assigned. I am leaning towards
javascript.el personally since it seems to be more comprehensive, but
I'm not very familiar with cc-mode. If someone who's more
knowledgeable could look review it to make sure it's reasonably
maintainable, I will contact the author to see if he's interested in
copyright assignment.

-Phil Hagelberg
http://technomancy.us

Re: javascript.el (was: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp)

[Richard Stallman]

    I suspect the best thing to do would be to install one of the last two
    modes listed if we can get copyright assigned. I am leaning towards
    javascript.el personally since it seems to be more comprehensive,

Can you ask the authors if they will sign papers?

Re: javascript.el (was: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp)

[Phil Hagelberg]

Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org> writes:

>     I suspect the best thing to do would be to install one of the last two
>     modes listed if we can get copyright assigned. I am leaning towards
>     javascript.el personally since it seems to be more comprehensive,
>
> Can you ask the authors if they will sign papers?

I've done so; he is willing to sign.

Could we get someone from the FSF to contact him so they can send him
the necessary documents? He may be reached at
karl.landstrom@brgeight.se.

-Phil

Re: javascript.el (was: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp)

[Richard Stallman]

    Could we get someone from the FSF to contact him so they can send him
    the necessary documents? He may be reached at
    karl.landstrom@brgeight.se.

I wrote to him (and cc'd you).

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Miles Bader]

Michael Olson <mwolson@gnu.org> writes:
>> Why did you put it in "net/"??  It's a formatted data I/O library, not
>> a network protocol...
>
> I placed it there because (1) I recall it being used by programs which
> interact with online services and (2) because it mentioned JavaScript,
> which is a language used in web-browsers.  Where else do you think it
> should go?

Dunno, but not net.  Probably just the root (lisp/).

Json is probably most directly comparable to xml.

-Miles

-- 
Fast, small, soon; pick any 2.

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Michael Olson]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 757 bytes --]

Miles Bader <miles@gnu.org> writes:

> Michael Olson <mwolson@gnu.org> writes:
>>
>> I placed it there because (1) I recall it being used by programs
>> which interact with online services and (2) because it mentioned
>> JavaScript, which is a language used in web-browsers.  Where else do
>> you think it should go?
>
> Dunno, but not net.  Probably just the root (lisp/).
>
> Json is probably most directly comparable to xml.

OK.  I've moved it to lisp/json.el and have added a NEWS entry for it.

-- 
|       Michael Olson  |  FSF Associate Member #652     |
| http://mwolson.org/  |  Hobbies: Lisp, HCoop          |
| Projects: Emacs, Muse, ERC, EMMS, ErBot, DVC, Planner |
`-------------------------------------------------------'

[-- Attachment #2: Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 188 bytes --]

Re: json.el - JavaScript Object Notation parser / generator for Emacs Lisp

[Edward O'Connor]

Michael Olson wrote:

> I've installed json.el as lisp/net/json.el.
[...]
> OK.  I've moved it to lisp/json.el and have added a NEWS entry for it.

Great, thanks!

> I updated the header and opted to replace the XEmacs compatibility
> code with a few defalias commands, to fix some compiler warnings.

Sounds good. I'll look into rewriting the XEmacs compatibility stuff
into a more byte-compiler friendly fashion.


-- 
Edward O'Connor
hober0@gmail.com