From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Kai Ma Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: etc/HELLO: On Chinese and Cantonese Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2020 14:25:40 +0800 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="22817"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Oct 22 08:26:50 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kVU3m-0005q1-M6 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 22 Oct 2020 08:26:50 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:37884 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kVU3l-00020q-Mk for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 22 Oct 2020 02:26:49 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:46370) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kVU32-0001a4-Mb for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 22 Oct 2020 02:26:04 -0400 Original-Received: from email6.ustc.edu.cn ([2001:da8:d800::8]:43131 helo=ustc.edu.cn) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kVU2w-0004Ne-Rm for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 22 Oct 2020 02:26:04 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mail.ustc.edu.cn; s=dkim; h=Received:From:To:Subject:Date: Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; bh=jCc6At393r/PyAl0rboEwVeCi6pERyNwV5K8R/DR/lQ=; b=NkXW6Zfy464ju Du28WFIctCydZMC/EYmRzE5yAKVkyEPELD75LUly+JqXQ4T60+mn2p1VrlZWchWL JZCXM5CwlJEzpfg6pt7eomEvB79VaYX7Rj7Uh1bqFBplPN2G/N66+uL1AWRinjVY y21LxRXINtJkK7G8XauokmnPVnpJUg= Original-Received: from MacBook-Pro.local (unknown [202.38.95.82]) by newmailweb.ustc.edu.cn (Coremail) with SMTP id LkAmygBXXc3mJZFfCcpBAA--.26929S2; Thu, 22 Oct 2020 14:25:42 +0800 (CST) X-CM-TRANSID: LkAmygBXXc3mJZFfCcpBAA--.26929S2 X-Coremail-Antispam: 1UD129KBjvJXoW7uFW8ur13XrW8Aw4UKF13CFg_yoW8Xr48pF 1Yvr1YqrWUZr47GrWvkr17ZrnYqrZYgF47AFy8Cwn8AFWrCF1fGr13uFWYvr1FyFs8Cryj vayYq34xXFs5Z3DanT9S1TB71UUUUUUqnTZGkaVYY2UrUUUUjbIjqfuFe4nvWSU5nxnvy2 9KBjDU0xBIdaVrnRJUUUkjb7Iv0xC_Kw4lb4IE77IF4wAFF20E14v26r1j6r4UM7CY07I2 0VC2zVCF04k26cxKx2IYs7xG6rWj6s0DM7CIcVAFz4kK6r1j6r18M28lY4IEw2IIxxk0rw A2F7IY1VAKz4vEj48ve4kI8wA2z4x0Y4vE2Ix0cI8IcVAFwI0_Ar0_tr1l84ACjcxK6xII jxv20xvEc7CjxVAFwI0_Cr0_Gr1UM28EF7xvwVC2z280aVAFwI0_GcCE3s1l84ACjcxK6I 8E87Iv6xkF7I0E14v26rxl6s0DM2AIxVAIcxkEcVAq07x20xvEncxIr21l5I8CrVACY4xI 64kE6c02F40Ex7xfMcIj6xIIjxv20xvE14v26r1j6r18McIj6I8E87Iv67AKxVW8JVWxJw Am72CE4IkC6x0Yz7v_Jr0_Gr1lF7xvr2IY64vIr41lc2xSY4AK67AK6r47MxAIw28IcxkI 7VAKI48JMxC20s026xCaFVCjc4AY6r1j6r4UMI8I3I0E5I8CrVAFwI0_Jr0_Jr4lx2IqxV Cjr7xvwVAFwI0_JrI_JrWlx4CE17CEb7AF67AKxVWUJVWUXwCIc40Y0x0EwIxGrwCI42IY 6xIIjxv20xvE14v26r1j6r1xMIIF0xvE2Ix0 X-CM-SenderInfo: pnvt2wo6pdxzwoxv3uoohg3hdfq/ Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2001:da8:d800::8; envelope-from=ksqsf@mail.ustc.edu.cn; helo=ustc.edu.cn X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -19 X-Spam_score: -2.0 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.0 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:258265 Archived-At: Hi emacs-devel I noticed recently in etc/HELLO Chinese and Cantonese are aligned side to side, which is linguistically incorrect. Though Chinese taxonomy is complex, there are two main viewpoints regarding Cantonese: 1. Chinese is a single language, and Cantonese is "a dialect of Chinese". 2. Chinese is a family of languages [1], and Cantonese belongs to this family. Neither of them sees Cantonese is separate from Chinese -- they both view Cantonese as a "kind" of Chinese. Putting Cantonese below is like putting French below Romance languages. Therefore, I propose to make the following changes. 1. Change "Chinese" to "Chinese, Mandarin". 2. Change "Cantonese" to "Chinese, Cantonese". This allows for future additions for other Sinitic languages. Or, since Sinitic languages are similar when written [2], it may be not very helpful to list each of them: 1. Remove the Cantonese line entirely; 2. Remove "=E6=99=AE=E9=80=9A=E8=AF=9D" (which means Mandarin) from the Chi= nese line; 3. Add "=E6=BC=A2=E8=AA=9E" to the Chinese line -- Chinese has not only one= written system [3]. What do you think? Regards Kai [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinitic_languages [2] Though the same words are pronounced differently. e.g. =E4=BD=A0=E5=A5= =BD in Cantonese is pronounced "nei hou", while in Mandarin is pronounced "ni hao". [3] See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traditional_Chinese_characters and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simplified_Chinese_characters=20