From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: John Wiegley Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: A vision for multiple major modes: some design notes Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2016 09:27:48 -0700 Message-ID: References: <20160420194450.GA3457@acm.fritz.box> <8360vb6o7u.fsf@gnu.org> <20160421213323.GD1775@acm.fritz.box> <20160614131305.GB4573@acm.fritz.box> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1465923730 23906 80.91.229.3 (14 Jun 2016 17:02:10 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2016 17:02:10 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Alan Mackenzie Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jun 14 19:01:54 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1bCrir-0006bi-8N for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 14 Jun 2016 19:01:53 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:36931 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bCriq-0007dj-CK for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 14 Jun 2016 13:01:52 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:59819) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bCrC2-0000l3-DK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 14 Jun 2016 12:28:00 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bCrBy-0001rT-Rf for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 14 Jun 2016 12:27:58 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-pa0-x22b.google.com ([2607:f8b0:400e:c03::22b]:33927) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bCrBy-0001rF-Kh for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 14 Jun 2016 12:27:54 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-pa0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id bz2so57849976pad.1 for ; Tue, 14 Jun 2016 09:27:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:date:message-id:references :user-agent:mail-followup-to:mime-version; bh=rrcb4lu/LSuinv1YXaO1c98/UzZXm+obl4G4EgJ/K1g=; b=s49DaM3yus8O/vfMC6CL/lOqr9trphyVUBBuzxxSia6W/VNGV+jCi3g+68CRY4LRPr lOJloSPYXGX/eCyXe/uz8eVIvlU8P4ynYWqpfiApUp+8MPKCmEGrp4E+tyQ3zWZXRNjN UKfR7yhWyk9KpWHQnkmsF7Y/QzUrym7ygVAcNsjhCFdg1rQ+BwH/7iRjKdGjcnpjo8Nd hJ9H7xrHbFiW6mh/AubeF/6UB5U8BF9gmgJZ7f4jFlk2OPNTSIRPw53T87GCRoaMjou7 LBKUrEFzUKv3ifRMyyXtX8O0ewvU4ktaEt1/h533rwpv3KYHefdb4keCCwJwh1VyxcJT +ZlA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:date:message-id :references:user-agent:mail-followup-to:mime-version; bh=rrcb4lu/LSuinv1YXaO1c98/UzZXm+obl4G4EgJ/K1g=; b=N/Y0CraIOE7YTouao7pz5nkdavHo6Qr/0m++KZJGv7mhNZ/D0GfplSEpx+Limay6Tr D/iBSZAajOJlrgVzfXF3umQ1D23xL67RSInEtRKUXD2m66HfTdQ/aJ1LwbNCPuDvz0/6 Ary577nYqjByg0s42FDhNdv512Ne9tEi3Fm0PkYIG65XnPiNpEa/J8+4DV2kEsv5k2qi ra6ARZ4MR1g9EHx107CVOywVqjGZDVO4oHBVInfDRy1sgDNt0Hqhem2CRQ9Xfn6pY88p cawkKe2xGdV6pgsSi/isEe6mkTKnh+tyX6qBddT/FEGY/1NA9LH5tY7h0V3oxPAGaA4K x//g== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tIrWu+YVMng8PbIXyGV7iGDdu9r8OfO3AusJ2zofteqIBiyeu9+GFnoYKxtkigldA== X-Received: by 10.66.189.167 with SMTP id gj7mr10546144pac.0.1465921673492; Tue, 14 Jun 2016 09:27:53 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from Vulcan.local (76-234-68-79.lightspeed.frokca.sbcglobal.net. [76.234.68.79]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id yp4sm12477706pab.48.2016.06.14.09.27.51 (version=TLS1 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 14 Jun 2016 09:27:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-Original-From: "John Wiegley" Original-Received: by Vulcan.local (Postfix, from userid 501) id BDBCF6C6EF0; Tue, 14 Jun 2016 09:27:50 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20160614131305.GB4573@acm.fritz.box> (Alan Mackenzie's message of "Tue, 14 Jun 2016 13:13:05 +0000") User-Agent: Gnus/5.130014 (Ma Gnus v0.14) Emacs/25.0.95 (darwin) Mail-Followup-To: Alan Mackenzie , emacs-devel@gnu.org X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:400e:c03::22b X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:204360 Archived-At: >>>>> Alan Mackenzie writes: >> I don't agree that this is the essence of major mode support. Another >> aspect of major modes is an expectation of which text properties might >> occur throughout the buffer, and where and why. > OK. Shall we agree that the buffer local variables are a crucially important > part of what constitutes a major mode? :-) Clearly text properties are > important (indeed, in the case of, e.g., CC Mode critically important) too. I'm sorry, after reading this again today I'm not sure why my reaction sounded so strong. Surely buffer local variables are a key, essential component to the picture. There is a "context" that defines what a mode is (buffer local vars, text properties, event bindings, etc), and we need a way of scoping such contexts within buffers, which you've begun describing in your proposal. -- John Wiegley GPG fingerprint = 4710 CF98 AF9B 327B B80F http://newartisans.com 60E1 46C4 BD1A 7AC1 4BA2