* emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads @ 2021-03-26 22:03 Uwe Brauer 2021-03-26 22:05 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor 2021-03-27 2:25 ` Daniel Martín 0 siblings, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Uwe Brauer @ 2021-03-26 22:03 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs Hi This is sort of absurd, using the compiled emacsformacox I cannot access the Mac specific folders such as Documents, Downloads, while I can access the files inside these folders. However this does not happen with the version I compiled from master. What is the reason for this behaviour and how can I solve it? Regards Uwe Brauer ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads 2021-03-26 22:03 emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads Uwe Brauer @ 2021-03-26 22:05 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor 2021-03-27 2:25 ` Daniel Martín 1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor @ 2021-03-26 22:05 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs Uwe Brauer wrote: > This is sort of absurd, using the compiled emacsformacox > I cannot access the Mac specific folders such as Documents, > Downloads, while I can access the files inside > these folders. Heh, Mac OS seems to give you a lot of problems :) It shouldn't, right? Because Emacs is the same everywhere. errr -- underground experts united https://dataswamp.org/~incal ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads 2021-03-26 22:03 emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads Uwe Brauer 2021-03-26 22:05 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor @ 2021-03-27 2:25 ` Daniel Martín 2021-03-27 6:34 ` Eli Zaretskii 2021-03-27 7:24 ` Uwe Brauer 1 sibling, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Daniel Martín @ 2021-03-27 2:25 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes: > Hi > > This is sort of absurd, using the compiled emacsformacox I cannot access > the Mac specific folders such as Documents, Downloads, while I can > access the files inside these folders. > > However this does not happen with the version I compiled from master. > > What is the reason for this behaviour and how can I solve it? > The reason is a security protection in recent versions of macOS where you need to grant explicit permission to applications if you want them to access your personal folders. Go to System Preferences, Security & Privacy, Privacy, Full Disk Access. Note that the Emacs launcher on macOS is actually a Ruby script, so you'd need to add /usr/bin/ruby there. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads 2021-03-27 2:25 ` Daniel Martín @ 2021-03-27 6:34 ` Eli Zaretskii 2021-03-27 7:12 ` Uwe Brauer 2021-03-27 7:24 ` Uwe Brauer 1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2021-03-27 6:34 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs > From: Daniel Martín <mardani29@yahoo.es> > Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 03:25:11 +0100 > > The reason is a security protection in recent versions of macOS where > you need to grant explicit permission to applications if you want them > to access your personal folders. Go to System Preferences, Security & > Privacy, Privacy, Full Disk Access. Note that the Emacs launcher on > macOS is actually a Ruby script, so you'd need to add /usr/bin/ruby > there. Should this information be in the Emacs user manual? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads 2021-03-27 6:34 ` Eli Zaretskii @ 2021-03-27 7:12 ` Uwe Brauer 2021-03-27 9:19 ` Pankaj Jangid 2021-03-27 12:20 ` Daniel Martín 0 siblings, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Uwe Brauer @ 2021-03-27 7:12 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 705 bytes --] >>> "EZ" == Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes: >> From: Daniel Martín <mardani29@yahoo.es> >> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 03:25:11 +0100 >> >> The reason is a security protection in recent versions of macOS where >> you need to grant explicit permission to applications if you want them >> to access your personal folders. Go to System Preferences, Security & >> Privacy, Privacy, Full Disk Access. Note that the Emacs launcher on >> macOS is actually a Ruby script, so you'd need to add /usr/bin/ruby >> there. > Should this information be in the Emacs user manual? Not sure, if you compile from master then this problem does not occur it seems to be more of a emacsformacosx thing [-- Attachment #2: smime.p7s --] [-- Type: application/pkcs7-signature, Size: 5673 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads 2021-03-27 7:12 ` Uwe Brauer @ 2021-03-27 9:19 ` Pankaj Jangid 2021-03-27 12:20 ` Daniel Martín 1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Pankaj Jangid @ 2021-03-27 9:19 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes: >>>> "EZ" == Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes: > >>> From: Daniel Martín <mardani29@yahoo.es> >>> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 03:25:11 +0100 >>> >>> The reason is a security protection in recent versions of macOS where >>> you need to grant explicit permission to applications if you want them >>> to access your personal folders. Go to System Preferences, Security & >>> Privacy, Privacy, Full Disk Access. Note that the Emacs launcher on >>> macOS is actually a Ruby script, so you'd need to add /usr/bin/ruby >>> there. > >> Should this information be in the Emacs user manual? > > > Not sure, if you compile from master then this problem does not occur it > seems to be more of a emacsformacosx thing This problem used to occur, about 6-months ago, every time I built a new binary. Have we changed something in Emacs to circumvent that? At least I don’t remember such a change. On my side, I have changed how I access Emacs. Earlier I used to start from macos terminal program. And now I just copy the ‘nextstep/Emacs.app’ to ‘~/Applications/Emacs.app’, and launch from Launchpad. As I am writing this, I have tried to build new binary and launched from command line. Now that is also working without any problem. All this may be happening because of following: 1. New macos was release in the mean time and it probably has new persistent settings for ‘~/Application/Emacs.app’ even if the user changes binary. 2. There are more settings for ‘Files and Folders’ with respect to ‘Terminal’ program. These new settings may be allowing anything launched from terminal. What should we add to user manual? Ideal use-case for a user should be to use the ‘nextstep/Emacs.app’ application. Like other applications in macos. But user may have downloaded pre-built binary from emacsformacosx.com, as the case in this thread. So, “Copy the freshly built ‘nextstep/Emacs.app’ to your ‘Applications’ directory. Go to System Preferences, Security & Privacy, Privacy, Full Disk Access. Allow ‘Emacs.app’ to access your file-system. Or, if you have downloaded a pre-built binary from emacsformacosx.com then allow ‘/usr/bin/ruby’ to access your file-system.” -- Regards, Pankaj Jangid ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads 2021-03-27 7:12 ` Uwe Brauer 2021-03-27 9:19 ` Pankaj Jangid @ 2021-03-27 12:20 ` Daniel Martín 2021-03-27 16:23 ` Uwe Brauer 2021-05-02 16:09 ` Uwe Brauer 1 sibling, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Daniel Martín @ 2021-03-27 12:20 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes: > > Not sure, if you compile from master then this problem does not occur it > seems to be more of a emacsformacosx thing Because of the way this protection feature works and the different ways you can build and run an Emacs binary for macOS, the casuistic is a bit complex. I'll try to summarize it: If you compile Emacs from the GNU repository on a macOS system, you have two ways to run the program: a) You can run "make" and then execute "src/emacs". In this case, Emacs will inherit the privacy permissions of your terminal. If your terminal does not already have permission to access personal folders, the first time you visit something in a personal folder from Emacs you will see a prompt "<Your terminal> would like to access files in your <Personal folder> folder". b) Alternatively, you can run "make install" and then double click on the "nextstep/Emacs.app" bundle, or move it to a more permanent directory, like /Applications. This is already the recommended way for developers to run the NS native port of Emacs, and the procedure is described in detail in "nextstep/INSTALL" from the Emacs repository. The first time Emacs needs to visit something in a personal folder it will prompt you in a similar way as a), but in the prompt it will show as "Emacs" making the request and not your terminal program, provided that you executed Emacs from the graphical user interface (for example, from Launchpad). If you prefer to use the version packaged from emacsformacosx.org, or similarly you installed Emacs using a popular package manager like Homebrew, there's a crucial difference: Emacs.app/Contents/MacOS/Emacs is *not* a binary, but a Ruby script. Why do the packagers use a custom launcher written in Ruby? It's a convenience for users so that a single download can contain Emacs binaries for all supported macOS versions. The Ruby launcher is maintained separately at https://github.com/caldwell/build-emacs This extra Ruby launcher is a nuisance for granting access to personal folders, because a prompt won't appear and you'll need to grant full disk access to "/usr/bin/ruby" manually. There is an open bug report in the "build-emacs" project to improve this: https://github.com/caldwell/build-emacs/issues/94 I'm happy to contribute this explanation to the Emacs manuals if you want (perhaps to the FAQ?), so that users can understand why they can't access their personal folders in Emacs without resorting to do an online search which in most cases do not offer the full explanation. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads 2021-03-27 12:20 ` Daniel Martín @ 2021-03-27 16:23 ` Uwe Brauer 2021-05-02 16:09 ` Uwe Brauer 1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Uwe Brauer @ 2021-03-27 16:23 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3419 bytes --] >>> "DM" == Daniel Martín <mardani29@yahoo.es> writes: > Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes: >> >> Not sure, if you compile from master then this problem does not occur it >> seems to be more of a emacsformacosx thing > Because of the way this protection feature works and the different ways > you can build and run an Emacs binary for macOS, the casuistic is a bit > complex. I'll try to summarize it: > If you compile Emacs from the GNU repository on a macOS system, you have > two ways to run the program: > a) You can run "make" and then execute "src/emacs". In this case, Emacs > will inherit the privacy permissions of your terminal. If your terminal > does not already have permission to access personal folders, the first > time you visit something in a personal folder from Emacs you will see a > prompt "<Your terminal> would like to access files in your <Personal folder> folder". That was I am doing at the moment and face some problems with my init files, problems I don't face in emacsformacos. Since I was unable to have my favorite lucid option compiled, I am not sure whether it would be better to switch to emacsforosox (I will not use the Mac most likely not for any development but more as backup solution of sorts) > b) Alternatively, you can run "make install" and then double click on > the "nextstep/Emacs.app" bundle, or move it to a more permanent > directory, like /Applications. This is already the recommended way for > developers to run the NS native port of Emacs, and the procedure is > described in detail in "nextstep/INSTALL" from the Emacs repository. > The first time Emacs needs to visit something in a personal folder it > will prompt you in a similar way as a), but in the prompt it will show > as "Emacs" making the request and not your terminal program, provided > that you executed Emacs from the graphical user interface (for example, > from Launchpad). Thanks for pointing this out. > If you prefer to use the version packaged from emacsformacosx.org, or > similarly you installed Emacs using a popular package manager like > Homebrew, there's a crucial difference: Emacs.app/Contents/MacOS/Emacs > is *not* a binary, but a Ruby script. Why do the packagers use a custom > launcher written in Ruby? It's a convenience for users so that a single > download can contain Emacs binaries for all supported macOS versions. > The Ruby launcher is maintained separately at > https://github.com/caldwell/build-emacs > This extra Ruby launcher is a nuisance for granting access to personal > folders, because a prompt won't appear and you'll need to grant full > disk access to "/usr/bin/ruby" manually. There is an open bug report in > the "build-emacs" project to improve this: > https://github.com/caldwell/build-emacs/issues/94 > I'm happy to contribute this explanation to the Emacs manuals if you > want (perhaps to the FAQ?), so that users can understand why they can't > access their personal folders in Emacs without resorting to do an online > search which in most cases do not offer the full explanation. First of all thanks for the detailed explanation which was extremely helpful. As far as the FAQ is concerned, I think that is a very good idea, may I suggest also to include the information of how to add the rugby script (as you did in a different email)? Regards Uwe [-- Attachment #2: smime.p7s --] [-- Type: application/pkcs7-signature, Size: 5673 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads 2021-03-27 12:20 ` Daniel Martín 2021-03-27 16:23 ` Uwe Brauer @ 2021-05-02 16:09 ` Uwe Brauer 1 sibling, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Uwe Brauer @ 2021-05-02 16:09 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1983 bytes --] >>> "DM" == Daniel Martín <mardani29@yahoo.es> writes: > Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes: >> >> Not sure, if you compile from master then this problem does not occur it >> seems to be more of a emacsformacosx thing Hi I realised that I did not answer your meail > Because of the way this protection feature works and the different ways > you can build and run an Emacs binary for macOS, the casuistic is a bit > complex. I'll try to summarize it: > If you compile Emacs from the GNU repository on a macOS system, you have > two ways to run the program: > a) You can run "make" and then execute "src/emacs". In this case, Emacs > will inherit the privacy permissions of your terminal. If your terminal > does not already have permission to access personal folders, the first > time you visit something in a personal folder from Emacs you will see a > prompt "<Your terminal> would like to access files in your <Personal folder> folder". Ok, I do this only for test purposes > b) Alternatively, you can run "make install" and then double click on > the "nextstep/Emacs.app" bundle, or move it to a more permanent > directory, like /Applications. This is already the recommended way for > developers to run the NS native port of Emacs, and the procedure is > described in detail in "nextstep/INSTALL" from the Emacs repository. > The first time Emacs needs to visit something in a personal folder it > will prompt you in a similar way as a), but in the prompt it will show > as "Emacs" making the request and not your terminal program, provided > that you executed Emacs from the graphical user interface (for example, > from Launchpad). Hm, I see, but why can't I have the good old unix-like way and install it say in /usr/local or as I prefer now /opt/emacs28 this way I could test say a stable version like emacs27 and the current master emacs28 I think I will rise this question in the dev emacs list. Regards Uwe [-- Attachment #2: smime.p7s --] [-- Type: application/pkcs7-signature, Size: 5673 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads 2021-03-27 2:25 ` Daniel Martín 2021-03-27 6:34 ` Eli Zaretskii @ 2021-03-27 7:24 ` Uwe Brauer 2021-03-27 12:22 ` Daniel Martín 1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread From: Uwe Brauer @ 2021-03-27 7:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 960 bytes --] >>> "DM" == Daniel Martín <mardani29@yahoo.es> writes: > Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes: >> Hi >> >> This is sort of absurd, using the compiled emacsformacox I cannot access >> the Mac specific folders such as Documents, Downloads, while I can >> access the files inside these folders. >> >> However this does not happen with the version I compiled from master. >> >> What is the reason for this behaviour and how can I solve it? >> > The reason is a security protection in recent versions of macOS where > you need to grant explicit permission to applications if you want them > to access your personal folders. Go to System Preferences, Security & > Privacy, Privacy, Full Disk Access. Note that the Emacs launcher on > macOS is actually a Ruby script, so you'd need to add /usr/bin/ruby > there. Thanks, but precisely to add /usr/bin/ruby seem almost impossible the interface does not allow you to add a simple string. [-- Attachment #2: smime.p7s --] [-- Type: application/pkcs7-signature, Size: 5673 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads 2021-03-27 7:24 ` Uwe Brauer @ 2021-03-27 12:22 ` Daniel Martín 0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread From: Daniel Martín @ 2021-03-27 12:22 UTC (permalink / raw) To: help-gnu-emacs Uwe Brauer <oub@mat.ucm.es> writes: > >> The reason is a security protection in recent versions of macOS where >> you need to grant explicit permission to applications if you want them >> to access your personal folders. Go to System Preferences, Security & >> Privacy, Privacy, Full Disk Access. Note that the Emacs launcher on >> macOS is actually a Ruby script, so you'd need to add /usr/bin/ruby >> there. > > Thanks, but precisely to add /usr/bin/ruby seem almost impossible the > interface does not allow you to add a simple string. Click on the plus sign ('+') and then press Shift+Command+G. A prompt will appear where you can type "/usr/bin/ruby" to go to that location. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2021-05-02 16:09 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 11+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2021-03-26 22:03 emacsformacos: cannot access mac folders: Documents/Downloads Uwe Brauer 2021-03-26 22:05 ` Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor 2021-03-27 2:25 ` Daniel Martín 2021-03-27 6:34 ` Eli Zaretskii 2021-03-27 7:12 ` Uwe Brauer 2021-03-27 9:19 ` Pankaj Jangid 2021-03-27 12:20 ` Daniel Martín 2021-03-27 16:23 ` Uwe Brauer 2021-05-02 16:09 ` Uwe Brauer 2021-03-27 7:24 ` Uwe Brauer 2021-03-27 12:22 ` Daniel Martín
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